Very Clinical: Is Academic Dentistry Better Than Private Practice?

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[00:00:55] Welcome to the Very Clinical Podcast. In about the time it takes to do an M.O. on three, we will entertain and amaze you with tips and tricks on regular daily dentistry. Here's Kevin and Zach. What is up, Very Clinical listeners? And welcome back to another episode of the Very Clinical Podcast. I'm Zach Miners coming to you from Kansas City. With me, as always, my trusty co-host, Dr. Kevin Hare Fryer. Kevin, what's up, man? Hey, we haven't done this for a while. A month? No. A half or so, maybe?

[00:01:25] Yep. It's been a little bit since we've recorded. We've used all that live footage from Scottsdale, which was awesome. Live, semi-live footage. Semi-live. Semi-live, something like that. I've got a guest this week, and this is the closest proximity guest that I've ever had. This is Dr. Melinda Meredith. Welcome to our show. She is one of my neighbors.

[00:01:48] She lives about 500 yards from me, so we're doing this online, despite the fact that we could probably kick a soccer ball to her house. I think this podcast would go a lot better if you got in some sort of mobile microphone unit and walked over to her house at the same time. I want to see what happens. Should I deliver a piece into her house or something? That sounds fantastic. Or ring her doorbell and run.

[00:02:15] Everyone in this neighborhood's got those creepy ring things, so I'd get busted. We don't have one, but we have cameras. Oh, I don't either. Okay. It's something. Okay, Melinda, before we get into this, give us your quick bio. You are a fellow UMKC grad. Yes. Tell us your educational background and how you got to where you're at in your professional career. Okay, so I did UMKC, graduated in 2007 from dental school.

[00:02:44] It wasn't my favorite four years of my life, but I'm glad I made it through. And being on the other side, I was glad it was hard. But during that time, I wasn't. I practiced in Independence, Missouri, very close to Dr. Miner's office, but we didn't know each other then. I mean, closer than we live, I think, possibly. Yes, I think that was only 300 yards, and now the house is 500 yards. Almost double. I'm getting this kind of stalker vibe. It is a little stalkery.

[00:03:10] Yeah, we're going to find out now just how stalkery I am. But I practiced there for seven and a half years. And I was in an associateship with a really great dentist, but it wasn't a great associateship. So I actually met with some old faculty and had lunch with a previous faculty member. And she told me why she loved working at the dental school.

[00:03:34] And I didn't really have – I wasn't willing to open up shop across the street from my aunt and ruin all future Christmases. So I thought it would be a good option to start in the school. So I began there in 2014, and I just started out being clinical. I did not totally know what I was doing. I was very popular at first, but now I know the rules and follow the rules. I was popular.

[00:03:58] And now I teach operative dentistry, and I'm currently teaching the bridge course that's the transition course from your D2 year into the clinic. Like in D3 is how it works at UMKC. So you started off on the floor when you first were hired doing all the clin checks and stuff like that. Yep. When did you transition into the pre-patient stuff? I started doing just a guest lecture, I think my second year, right away. Okay.

[00:04:24] But I was still on the clinic floor 100% of the time, except that one lecture I had. And then I became a co-course director because – I don't know if you remember Dr. Brian Williams. He didn't want to lecture. I do. Yep. He did the lab, and I kind of took most of the lecture. So it was maybe the gentlest way to get into that position. And I always wanted to teach operative dentistry. I mean, I kind of peaked pretty early on. I don't know where it's going to go from here.

[00:04:50] But I just ended up – and I think how I got it, I was able to go to a code meeting, which is the Consortium of Operative Dentistry Educators. Don't know why you'd know that, but it's, I think, nine schools in our region. And Dr. Perk, who is a genius, was not available, and they had to settle for me that time. And I kind of got the end into teaching operative. Okay. So I've taught operative in some capacity for about six years as the full course director. But I'm still on the floor a lot.

[00:05:19] I like that. Oh, you are? Okay. So you're still doing the clin checks and all that kind of stuff. So are you teaching like the class one, class two, class three, you know, those preps, all those? And I've got the first-year dental students who are still in a good mood about dental school. Okay. Right on. Once you get to second year. You get to ruin it? I don't ruin it. Maybe that is what happens. Maybe it's my class. But they're still very positive and eager, you know?

[00:05:46] And I think by second year, it settles in how challenging dental school curriculum is. Sure. So, all right. Let's talk about what is it like to be a dentist at an educational facility? Since you've done both, and you've done them both for about the same amount of time, right? Yeah. I overtook private practice recently. Yeah. So- For me, I like it. I love it.

[00:06:14] I think a lot of people go into dentistry because they want to be their own boss. And that's, it turns out, not what I wanted to be. So I really enjoy being kind of the, maybe small fish in a big pond would be one way to put it. But I like it being able to collaborate. On the negative, you know, you've got drama in your office. Man, there's some drama at the dental school too. I'm sure. I can only imagine.

[00:06:41] You can kind of, you know, you can stay in your group for the most part. But the budgeting issues, you have no control over that. I think it's really challenging for people who were in successful private practice for a long time to come back and have no power really. You know, no say over the budget, no say over the decisions being made. I was luckily an associate, so I never had to make that steep transition. So, yeah. Drama from faculty or drama from students or drama from administration? We don't really get in the administration.

[00:07:12] You know, then it's like an honors council violation and you can't talk about it. So I don't want to know about that. I don't want to know specifics. No. And you kind of hear, but it's more just, you know. Is it power struggle stuff? Like, you know, is it that kind of thing? Or is it just like... It's more like I didn't like what this person said. And I feel like I shouldn't say... It's still... There's... You don't have to say specifics.

[00:07:41] I'll give you names. You can be very... Dates. Yeah. Yes. No, I feel like... Specific incidences, names, dates, times. Remember how when we were in dental school, at least when I was, there's a very high school kind of vibe. You know, there are cliques. And I think that that's definitely still going on with the students. And maybe there's a little bit of that with faculty too. I also think... I can see it. It's so easy to think you know how to do someone who's, you know, a department chair or a dean.

[00:08:11] Like, why don't they do this for their job? Because I don't know what their job is. So it's super easy for me to think I would do it better. I mean, I don't think that because I lack the confidence. But I think a lot of people have that kind of opinion. They're used to being top dog. So they don't understand. There's not one dentist in this office. There's 210 and they don't know what they're doing. So it's a very different animal. And I don't know what all their job entails, but it's not a job I would ever want to do. So I think a little bit of that.

[00:08:41] Are students changing much as the years have gone by? Yes. Yes. So let's break that down. Let's hear more. I think the biggest issue with the changes in students is the generational communication divide, right? We were very much taught from a pedestal. I'm the doctor. You do what I say. And a little bit of fear me, right? There were a few nice faculty members, especially on the clinic floor.

[00:09:07] But in our didactic coursework, I really was under the impression, you do what they say, you don't question it. And I'm kind of scared of you. And there's some of that. But I think this generation of students comes at everything from a more collaborative standpoint. So they are much more likely to question faculty.

[00:09:32] And I don't think it comes from a place of being entitled or needy. I think it comes from a place of just being in general more collaborative. You know, I always think of that movie 21 Jump Street. Do you remember that with Channing Tatum? Yeah, sure. Just talking about the bullies. Like the bullies aren't the cool, dumb jocks anymore. Like everybody can be kind of cool. And I feel like this generation is a lot more gentle in that way.

[00:10:02] Everybody can be accepted. We can all collaborate and get along. And I have trouble with that as well. Have to remember, they're just asking for something. They're not questioning my authority. And I think that faculty, you know, that taught us really have trouble with that. So that's, I think I have a little more positive spin on it than some other faculty members. And we're not even in millennials now, right? We're in Gen Z. So it's a totally different.

[00:10:32] I also think they learn. I mean, they've had a computer in their pocket their whole life, right? So there's no need for them to memorize every medication on the planet. They can look it up. I've been talking a lot about that just in case versus just in time learning. I don't know if that's something you guys talk about. My kids are sick of caring about it. But so just in case is how we're all taught, you know, memorize it all just in case you need it. And for dentistry, you absolutely need to have some of that.

[00:10:59] Because if your patient has a heart attack, you can't look it up, right? Right. But so much of how these students learn, I think, is because of, is that just in time learning? Because they can Google it in a half a second. And I think it's very, I think that's a very hard cultural distinction that we need to be. Oh, I could definitely see that.

[00:11:23] I mean, like for sure in dental school, like the best play, and I'm sure Kevin and I, we've talked about this before, was to put your head down and just like you didn't want to be noticed. You just wanted to get through. Like in general, you didn't want to make any waves. Was that your experience, Kevin, for the most part? Like just put your head down and through. I figured out after the first couple of days or first week, like just, you know, let's just maintain my anonymity and get through this. Yeah, for sure. I think, I think, you know, we weren't.

[00:11:52] Although that didn't last at the end. My, well, anyway, my question is, is in terms of communication style, I think this generation, you know, they communicate via text more than face to face. At least that's my experience with that generation of patients. Like it's very hard to get more than a grunt out of some young people.

[00:12:21] How has that affected your job? That is more just kind of a battle trying to convince our students to call their patients. And a big part of that is tone. You don't get tone when you're texting people. And I hate calling people anymore. But if it's a patient, you know, who's over, like any older than us, really, you got to call them, especially the first time. And then if it's any patient under 30, they're not going to answer your call.

[00:12:51] I kind of understand the need to text those patients. But our clinic dean, of course, no, call them. And the first time I think you should call them. But the biggest issue I've seen with that is patients getting upset because texting something comes across completely differently than when you hear someone's tone of voice. Sure. Absolutely. But how about communication with the faculty? Like the students, the students communicating with the faculty. Students with the faculty. We're so lucky.

[00:13:21] These are the brightest students, you know. Sure. I think 95%, very professional, very respectful. Some of that 95% are a little casual just as a generational thing. I think about how people used to dress to go on airplanes versus now when we're basically wearing our nice pajamas, right? Like stretchy pants. And you didn't. I mean, I'm not like talking about the 30s when you dressed up to go to the movies. But it's very, it's a much more casual group.

[00:13:50] So, yes, there is more casual conversation. I still dress up to go to the movies. Okay. I'm sorry. I said that. I meant the 2030s. It's coming back. But, yeah, so there is a casual tone. And I do have to kind of watch myself to maintain that professional tone. And I think that that can sometimes be construed as disrespectful, even if that's not the intent of.

[00:14:14] What is it like working with students that, like, I mean, you could, let's be honest. I think you could learn a lot of operative dentistry on YouTube. Yeah. These days. I mean, there's some channels that I've watched that are, like, exceptionally high quality. Stevenson? Yes. Yes. Stevenson. I mentioned Stevenson in class. We don't have the resources to make videos that nice at the public dental school I work at.

[00:14:44] So we have good pictures. But I think it's a double-edged sword. I like Stevenson, though. I like his techniques. Sure. Well, he teaches by the book. He truly teaches by the book. And that's dental school on YouTube, if you ask me. Yes. Because he's teaching a foreign trained. He's teaching a foreign dentist to get him to pass the USA exam. That's where he comes from. I didn't know that. That's his market. That makes sense. Yeah. That's his entire market is someone who's coming over here to try to get a USA license. It's foreign trained.

[00:15:11] He's teaching them exact preps to pass the onlay boards or whatever. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. And boards are a whole other thing. I know that's changed a lot. Pass, fail now? And clinic boards are not on patients anymore? Yeah. But let's go back to YouTube. Go back. Yeah. Go back to YouTube. Yeah. Because, yeah. Melinda, I went to dental school in the 80s. So, there was no YouTube.

[00:15:41] There was no YouTube when I went either. And Melinda's YouTube was pretty good. Right on the edge, right? I didn't have YouTube. Yeah. Well, there probably wasn't dental videos. There wasn't dental videos, right? Just cats. I would have digested that. Like, I would have, you know, but I would have digested it and really dove deep into that. But I also think I probably would have got different opinions than what I was being taught. And then how do you reconcile that? Yes. Yeah.

[00:16:11] So, it is kind of a double-edged sword. The pros are, you've got a video that's really high quality that's showing you a really good way to do something, especially if you're using something like Stevenson's, which I've mentioned and I heard about from students. So, they told me about it. Sure. I think they're pretty great. But students are not reading the lab manuals. If you could do both and kind of marry the two, that would be great. And again, probably most of the students are reading the lab manuals, but they're not the ones who are coming and asking me,

[00:16:41] well, what bird do I use? It's like, well, look at page 20, man. I spent a lot of time on this lab manual. Please just look at it before asking the question. It is a very much, that is a complaint I have. They're not going to look for the answer first. A lot of the time, they're going to come right to you or, you know, show me. I don't know how to do it. Well, read it first. Or, I don't know, watch a Stevenson video first at least. Do something that showed you tried. Which, can you guys imagine doing that?

[00:17:09] Coming up to your faculty and being like, I have no idea what to do. Show me. Oh, did you read the lab manual? Oh, no. What? Right. No, I'd expect, well, at least in the, you know, early 00s, you know, they'd have a snappy response for you. They did dress you down. Yeah. I'm sure that's probably frowned upon now. But, I mean, like, then it was like, you know, that's what they did. Yeah, you'll get, some of the students have, if they have a problem with the course director, they go right to the dean of education. Mm-hmm.

[00:17:39] Yeah. Which is a real problem. So, there have been some policies that have gone out about that, which I appreciate. They back the faculty up. It's just. Good. Again, I can't imagine going. First of all, would not approach a faculty. Second, I wouldn't go over their head. So. Yeah. No, I would, that would have been, that would not have even entered my, like, conscious thought. You could talk to them. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I would have been like, you can, do you get, does this generation blast you with emails? Like, of, like, questions and. Yeah.

[00:18:09] Kind of stuff, too? Yeah. And I don't. Because I wouldn't have emailed a faculty member. We had email, but, I mean, it was pretty limited. But, you know, I wouldn't have done that. Yeah, we get some emails. I don't mind that. I'll try to put it on our, you know, we used to have Blackboard learning management system. It's Canvas now. So, I'll try to answer the question for everybody. There's another. Yeah, yeah. I don't mind the email. They do get sent about a thousand emails a day.

[00:18:37] And I take it very personally when they don't read the one from me. You know, I don't care if you read the others, but this is in the email I sent you. I know I talked about it. Crazy Dental already has some of the lowest prices on dental supplies anywhere. But you know what's even crazier? Free shipping. Head over to crazydentalprices.com, load up your cart, and use coupon code VERYSHIP. That's VERYSHIP for free shipping on every single order. Plus, every time you use that code, Crazy Dental kicks back support to the Very Dental Podcast Network.

[00:19:06] Save money, get free shipping, and support the show. Use code VERYSHIP today. So, I don't really, I don't mind that. You don't get a lot of people visiting during office hours, though. Okay. Vacation time. I know you've got a lot better than I do. Yeah. Let's talk about some of those perks. That is fantastic. Some of those shop perks. Can I, before we get into these perks. Okay, go ahead. Yeah, go ahead. Working with students. No, no.

[00:19:35] This is, it's really, really fulfilling. It is so fulfilling. I thought I would like it, but I mean, it really feeds your soul. And sometimes you'll get a thank you note that says something specific about what you did, or, you know, someone tells you, like, you really made a difference. Man, that's even better than vacation time. But we do get a lot of vacation time. We get four weeks that we can take whenever, and then we get a week off in between spring and summer semesters.

[00:20:03] We get a week off between summer and fall semesters. We get Thanksgiving week, two weeks of Christmas, spring break. So, whenever you're about to, like, feel burnout and think you're just, you know, gonna light it on fire, you get to take a little break off, you know, and kind of reset yourself. It is really nice. It's great. Do you work five days a week, Linda, when you are on? Yeah, I'm only four. Okay. My contract started kind of in a golden time.

[00:20:31] So, I got in with vesting. So, I, and I don't even know all of what that means, but it's a really great retirement situation. A lot of that stuff's been taken away. My benefits are really good. They're not as good as my husband who works for a student loan company, but they're pretty great. They're, I'm sure, better than when you own an office with four employees, the deals you can get there. Sure. So, that's really nice. What was the question that I got off track? Vacation?

[00:21:01] Oh, yeah. I was, I was just asking, I was asking for some of the, some of your perks. Because like I said, I know you're, I know you're off. Yeah, I was off last week. I thought that was a winner. Yeah. Really nice. Sometimes, you know, I'll go in on a Friday. I go in on my, I'm off on Fridays. I go in quite a bit on those days. And then I can have lunch downtown. It's not a big deal. Also good for the economy because I'm not commuting on the days I don't go in on Friday. So, we're saving a lot of. That's great. Yeah. Right?

[00:21:31] Now, I know some of the, I know some faculty people have faculty practice. Do you do that still? Do you? No. No, I haven't. Did you ever done that or did you? You have not done it. I haven't at UMKC. I did stay on once a week in my associate for the association for the first year to kind of cover. Um, and then I used to go in during like Christmas breaks and work at an office.

[00:21:54] And I haven't for a little while and I feel kind of guilty about it sometimes, but mostly I really appreciate having that time to myself. But I only worked four days a week when I was in private practice too. And I kind of think for dentistry, it's hard on your body. Four days a week. I hope that you guys work four days a week. Five days is too many. Yep. Yep. Um, okay.

[00:22:17] Before I get into the trivia component here, I got a, I got a couple of, we got to get into some like, uh, we got a few nerdy clinical things we got to hit since that's our usual, the point of our, of our show. Okay. So are you still teaching amalgam preps? We are, but we are doing a lot less amalgam. So I actually just revamped our operative one because that's, that used to be all amalgam. And it probably was when you were in school. It was when I was in school. Yep. Now we have one class two amalgam prep and restoration.

[00:22:47] And the other two that we focus on for, for practical exams, I mean, are both, we've got a class one composite and a class two composite restoration. And so, yes, which, and I, I think it's still something that's nice to have in your toolbox. Oh yeah. No, no, no, no shade. I just didn't know if like, you know, I just didn't know what, what prep they were, they were teaching these days. Yeah. That stuff. So a little bit above.

[00:23:14] Kind of compare the difference between the preps, which I think is good for like real, like recognizing the fundamentals. Yeah. Do you still, do you teach the crown preps or are you strictly, strictly operative? So I'll work with crowns in clinic, but not. Okay. Teach that class. Kevin, do you have any clinical questions for Melinda or, or, or work question. Go ahead. I'm more curious about what kind of, you know, digital stuff is being taught, but with operative.

[00:23:45] Um, not a lot with operative, but in our clinic, we do have, we, I wish we had newer cameras. I mean, I think we have the Omnicam, but it is not the newest. We do have some milling machines. Um, it is kind of hard there on the second floor cause they've got to be in a locked room. So you've got to go from a clinic on the first floor to the second floor to use them. Um, not all of us are very good with it, but we're doing a fair amount of digital dentures and a fair amount of milled crowns.

[00:24:13] And we, we do also do digital impressions of crowns and then send them to our lab as well. So. So what's the criteria for scanning for a crown in, you know, in place of PBS? Like, do we have specific. Yeah. Like if I'm a student and I'm like, Hey, I got to do this crown on 19. I want to scan this one. That's okay. Yes. It's kind of faculty choice. It is interesting.

[00:24:39] A lot of times the students, if they're having trouble getting impressions with the, and they call it VPS at school now, isn't that crazy? I think you should call it SVP just for time. Yeah. I don't know what that means. Yeah. You should definitely really screw everyone up. I'll try it out. But I don't think they understand. You still need a dry field to do, especially with our cameras to do a digital impression. So that's not something I'm real good at, but our department chair has been really proactive.

[00:25:07] I think for a dental school and getting those. Do you have to like, do you have to check out the scanner if you want to use it for the day? If you have. There's one in each team. There might be two in each team, but one working one in each team at any time. And then, you know, if you're working with me, it's going to take you twice as long. So they're not going to work with me. You do have to have some traditional PBS impressions as well as at least one scanned impression to graduate. I got it. I gotcha.

[00:25:37] Are most of the dental school crowns being done in zirconia or PFM or? We almost never do PFM anymore. Okay. Sometimes Dr. Gottman will treatment plan one, but a lot of zirconia. Um, I still like lithium to sell it. I silicate if it's sure. I know if it's on a premolar and you don't have a crazy, uh, Bruxer or something like that. Yep. Our Dean is a lawyer as well as a dentist. So I know he has some questions. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:26:06] Our notes are going to get a lot better. He has some questions about the ethics of putting something that hard in someone's mouth and what the longterm results are going to be, which I think so far it's been pretty positive. I don't like cutting them off. So that's why I don't love the zirconia and they're not as pretty as lithium by silicate. I worry that a lot of paper students are going to get a milling machine and start making crowns that they shouldn't be making and they could get a better. What do you mean by that?

[00:26:35] Um, you know, you're going to pay, well, the machines aren't as much as they were when they first started coming out. But I remember when you're buying a hundred thousand dollar machine, you're not sending anything to a lab to be made. You know, you're going to be, uh, milling it in house. And I kind of worry that students would do that without, you know, they've done one in school. And if they don't have a good mentor to really show them how to do an excellent crown design, maybe they would be delivering.

[00:27:03] Well, you know, you can direct them to Kevin. That's, that's in his wheelhouse. That's the kind of stuff he teaches. Excellent. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You can teach me. Yeah. Kevin, Kevin does a lot of his teaching with, uh, Tarun Agarwal, T-Bone, who was also a UMKC grad from 1989. He's, you know that name or not? I like it. No. Yeah. Well, anyway, he's, he's an, he's a 99 UMKC grad. Like continuing ed classes? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:27:29] He's got, he's got a whole entire like facility for that kind of stuff amongst other things. We have to come to you. Oh yeah. Yeah. That's right. I was, I had the right state. I did not have the right. You're close. It's like when someone says I have a cousin in Cincinnati, do they know? Do you know them? Like five hours from here, but yeah, I know them. Yeah. He definitely, you definitely know who they are. Well, that's for sure. You can tell me later. Go ahead.

[00:27:59] No, you can, you can ask. So you're, you're practicing generalist, right? But you also provide. I'm a practicing dentist and I, I, I don't provide them. I'm a mentor for the 3d digital implant continuum where we teach people guided surgery. So when you said previously on this very podcast that your heart glows when you get a nice email

[00:28:25] I know exactly what you're talking about because I will periodically get texts from an attendee. Thank you so much. This is the first implant I placed in my own practice. You were so helpful. And I like, no, I'm, I joke around a lot, but that really does make my day. Like I'm, I'm floating around my office when I get one. It's crazy. What a difference that stuff makes. Yeah. A hundred percent. We are not, we're not placing our own implants.

[00:28:55] But our AED program is opening back up and they are learning. Oh, is it? Okay. Yes. We've got a new AED director who seems amazing. She, she, I'm really excited to have her. So we had kind of an off year. You, you had a pretty glowing review of, of, of being a faculty member, Melinda. Is there anything you miss about private practice? I do miss seeing my family easily. Yeah. Or being able to, you know, prescribe antibiotics. Being able to treat your family.

[00:29:25] That's what I miss the most. I miss that a lot. I don't miss when somebody I don't know that well asks me to prescribe them something. It's like, oh, I'm under the school's license. I can't. Yeah. So that's nice. For sure. Yeah. Okay. We were, we were supposed to do this at the beginning, but somehow I got off track and I messed it up. So are you ready for some UMKC slash UMKC dental school trivia to see how you, how well you know your own work? I'm so nervous. Yes. I'm really nervous too.

[00:29:57] Can you Google it? Okay. All right. Yeah. I'll Google the answers and text them to you. Cone of a friend. All right. Um, I'll even give you some leeway on this one. I'll give you like a, give you like a 20 year leeway. Do you know approximately what year the dental school, UMKC dental school was established? 21? 1921? Uh, I'm going to not accept that because it is, it is 1881. Oh.

[00:30:27] 1881. That was so close. 1881. So close. Now, uh, I would have accepted 1941 because that's the year they officially became University of Kansas city. Okay. But 21, I'm sorry. That's a big no. Yeah. You split the difference on that. You did get the one. You got the one. And, and, and the right millennium. So yeah, there we go. So we got that. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay.

[00:30:56] This famous, uh, this famous dental instrument used for amalgam created by a UMKC graduate in 1907. Hollenbeck Carver. Boom. All right. You got it. Dr. Hollenbeck, 1907 grad. All right. You made it. Okay. The UMKC Rue. The original design was drawn by a very famous artist. Walt Disney. Boom. Yeah. All right.

[00:31:27] Okay. The creator of dental town was a 1987 UMKC graduate. I know that. Can you name him? No, but I know that. Yes. Phone a friend. Hang on. Give her a five. I'm not going to get. Would you like to phone Kevin? Kevin, Kevin, go ahead. That would be a Howard Ferran. Correct. Yes. I knew it was a UMKC. You weren't going to get there? Never. No. Okay.

[00:31:54] Well, you know, two out of four is it's that's, I guess, is that passing? Is that passing? No, it's not passing. 50%? It's not passing. Okay. No, it's not. This is humiliating. All right. Well, that's a real bummer. It's a real bummer. Well, you had four questions only? Yeah. I don't need any more. You want to make her feel too bad. Oh. No. Okay. That's all right. What do you got one? Yeah. The Walt Disney one is amazing. It's really cute. Yeah. Walt Disney. Yeah.

[00:32:21] They don't use his, uh, his design anymore, but it was definitely. I think you can get it on some shirts. You can. Yeah. You can get the original. Yeah. It's really cute. You can get the original design out. He has an interesting city story. Walt Disney. Not dental related. Sorry. Go on. No, no, not dental related. Nope. That, that's, uh, so anyway, that's, that covers, uh, what it's like to be a dentist at a dental education. Yeah. It covers everything. We're going to bring, uh, that was everything.

[00:32:47] We're going to bring Melinda back next week, uh, to talk about, uh, just the kind of the state of dental education and kind of what's, what's going on. So any final words, Kevin? Um, I love this discussion. I love the, uh, you know, that you're teaching our youths how to, uh, you're, you're responsible for their, their prep moving forward. And it's all you just hope they're not. All right. Thank you guys for listening. Don't forget to, uh, join our, uh, very clinical Facebook page.

[00:33:16] If you haven't already, Kevin's still not charging admission. So that's all. I might start this month. I need, oh, this is it. Oh my gosh. I don't want to vacation in the summer. I need some lettuce, some cheddar. All right. Uh, we will catch you guys next Tuesday. See ya.