Very Dental: Do What You Like with Dr. Rob Ritter

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[00:01:01] [SPEAKER_03]: This is a production of the Very Dental Podcast Network.

[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_03]: This is the Very Dental Podcast.

[00:01:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome to the Very Dental Podcast where you'll find entertaining and relevant conversations

[00:01:26] [SPEAKER_03]: with visionaries, clinicians and your friends in the dental space. Now here's your host

[00:01:32] [SPEAKER_03]: and benevolent leader Dr. Alan Mead. Very dental people welcome back to another episode

[00:01:39] [SPEAKER_03]: of the Very Dental Podcast. I'm your host Alan Mead and joining me is someone who's been on

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_03]: the show quite a few times and has become a friend of the show. I actually got to meet him

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_03]: live in person back when we used to do meetings in person at the Spear Summit in 2019

[00:01:55] [SPEAKER_03]: where he came off the dental hacks had a booth like it was awesome. Basically the people came

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_03]: off the main stage at the Spear Summit and then like walk into our booth and we so we got to

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_03]: like we got to talk to them right after they came off the big stage that was pretty awesome.

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Joining me Dr. Rob Ritter. Rob how are you doing? I'm great thank you for asking and it's

[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_01]: great to be back as usual. I really enjoy spending time with you so it's always a

[00:02:25] [SPEAKER_01]: time we have and all I can say is every time we chat the hour goes by so fast I look down

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_03]: and I can't believe we've chatted for an hour. No it does now interestingly last week Rob and I

[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_03]: in literally moments ago just had another technical glitch. Rob and I tried this episode

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_03]: we recorded the entire episode and somehow there was a glitch in the recording and

[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_03]: that is that's the podcaster in me goes yeah that's like pretty normal that's like

[00:02:50] [SPEAKER_03]: par for the course basically so we're going to give this another try and what's really

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_03]: interesting is the timing was interesting last time too because like a year or five years

[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_03]: prior to the recording we did like to the day we had done a podcast or put out a podcast where

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Rob and Jason and I were talking about the nobility of being a restorative dentist without

[00:03:11] [SPEAKER_03]: a lot of the specialty aspects and I'll put a link in the show notes to that episode

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_03]: and Rob made me feel like you know what you don't have to do all that so but I'm going to

[00:03:22] [SPEAKER_03]: before we get into that I do I want to ask you a little bit about like when we talked last time

[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_03]: last week you had literally just finished up with another basically edition of the course

[00:03:33] [SPEAKER_03]: that you and Chris Ramsey your partner have put together the protocol and I want to and I

[00:03:38] [SPEAKER_03]: really did I enjoyed hearing about it what how are you feeling a week out after your

[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_01]: protocol the last protocol? Well thanks for asking I feel a lot better today because I

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_01]: day off to relax yeah I cannot believe it's been a week since the course it went really really

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_01]: well the responses we've gotten from everybody involved are so fulfilling for me when I decided

[00:04:02] [SPEAKER_01]: to come up with this whole process and put this course together I really didn't know I mean if

[00:04:07] [SPEAKER_01]: anybody tells you when they do something like this that they knew exactly what it was going

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_01]: to be and how it was going to turn out I don't think they're I don't think they're

[00:04:17] [SPEAKER_01]: and me and Chris put this together and we're very very pleased with the way it turned out

[00:04:25] [SPEAKER_01]: our course is it's basically a no compromise course right it goes back to circling back

[00:04:30] [SPEAKER_01]: to what you said at the beginning we just decided what we want to do we decided what

[00:04:35] [SPEAKER_01]: type of dentist we want to be and we're restorative only there's nothing wrong with

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_01]: being a super dentist I just chose early in my career it's not really what I wanted to do

[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_01]: and that's what this course has kind of become it's it's it's our journey all wrapped up into

[00:04:51] [SPEAKER_01]: a two-day course it's my 27 year journey through CE taking the best of the best having

[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_01]: gone through you know Dawson and Spear and Coice and Piper and PacLive and everything else

[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_01]: and weeding out all the things that we think are either superfluous or you can get

[00:05:07] [SPEAKER_01]: other places and then being able to tie it all together into one very streamlined workflow

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_01]: both digitally and communicatively in our in our two-day course and it's it's really the most

[00:05:23] [SPEAKER_01]: fulfilling education I've ever given because obviously I don't have to travel but more

[00:05:28] [SPEAKER_01]: importantly we're doing it in our office in a small group setting which is no better way

[00:05:33] [SPEAKER_01]: to learn because of the interaction yeah we'll get to know each other they start to share

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_01]: my team members are there so they get to with the breakouts talk to my treatment coordinator

[00:05:40] [SPEAKER_01]: talk to my office man or talk to our clinical lead assistants of what we really do and maybe

[00:05:45] [SPEAKER_01]: the things that we don't have time to go over in the course but they break out and ask them

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_01]: the question so I today I heard from two people Alan that took the course okay one person says

[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_01]: they went back this week sold two arches of dentistry wow the other person says oh my gosh

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_01]: let me tell you we have this implementation list of things that we've already begun to

[00:06:05] [SPEAKER_01]: implement I've already talked to three people there's no compromise in the treatment now I find

[00:06:09] [SPEAKER_01]: myself speaking less letting my diagnosis kind of speak for itself with big pictures

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_01]: it's it's that kind of transformative two days that again I want to make sure I'm very clear

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_01]: about this point I must make this point this is not a substitute for going through sphere

[00:06:26] [SPEAKER_01]: education and taking how many courses are there or going through the COIS curriculum and

[00:06:32] [SPEAKER_01]: nine courses there it is not a substitute for that it's an addendum it's an add-on it ties

[00:06:37] [SPEAKER_01]: it all together if you want to go there you absolutely should get all of the reference

[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_01]: material get all the reasoning why but what they don't teach you because they don't have

[00:06:46] [SPEAKER_01]: the time is an implementation strategies that Chris share with you and and that's really

[00:06:52] [SPEAKER_01]: just tying it all together and everybody says the exact same thing this has done for me

[00:06:56] [SPEAKER_01]: what I could not seem to find anywhere else that's awesome so it's a matter of learning

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_03]: how to execute on the stuff that you've learned at some of the other institute style and I mean

[00:07:05] [SPEAKER_03]: honestly there's so many great ones of those this is just like the addendum to the the stuff

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_03]: that the stuff that you don't learn there I like that if that's all it is I would argue

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_03]: that's probably one of the harder parts because we're all dentists like to be up in our heads

[00:07:16] [SPEAKER_03]: about this stuff so like part of it is we can kind of we love that we love the learning

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_03]: part of it we love the the the mechanics of it all that stuff but the problem is is that

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_03]: real thing is on the ground doing it that's the real thing right that that's and that is

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_01]: the tough part right you're talking with human beings who come to see you they find you somehow

[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_01]: whether it be word of mouth social media website finding you you know doing global

[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_01]: searches or yelp searches and then they're coming to you which means and Chris says it

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_01]: if they're coming to see you they made the appointment for the consultation they're 90

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_01]: of the way there they found some sort of connection with you they're building a trust relationship

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_01]: before they even come and see you they there's something about you that screams this is the

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_01]: person that can help me the last 10 percent is the tough part it's it's connecting with them

[00:08:08] [SPEAKER_01]: you know in the moment being honest with them about what they have and how how you can help

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_01]: but we make no bones about it this course is not about giving them option one through 10

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_01]: that is not what this is about it's being honest with the patient and showing them you know both

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_01]: from a digital chair side scanner and digital photography that gets put up on a on a 50 inch

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_01]: tv what is in their mouth what their problem is and how to fix it there is no soft shoeing

[00:08:38] [SPEAKER_01]: it there's no bait and switch this is the way it is you own it it's your teeth when you

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_01]: out of here it's your mouth not mine i'm an expediter i can make this happen it's your tooth

[00:08:47] [SPEAKER_01]: your buck this is what i can do to get you there once you start making compromises to that

[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_01]: treatment what happens it starts to go south and remember one of my lines is uh well you know

[00:08:59] [SPEAKER_01]: what i say to patients is just because you don't want to do the right thing doesn't mean

[00:09:02] [SPEAKER_01]: i'm going to do the wrong thing but the other one is when you start feeling bad for patients

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_02]: you start making bad decisions oh yeah oh yeah i think there's a lot of people that

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_03]: myself included i would say that i would say that probably people listening are like okay okay

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_03]: we've heard so and you told me last week that the uh 2022 course dates or the course

[00:09:24] [SPEAKER_03]: registration is actually going to be dropping mid-september is that right yes actually alan

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_01]: thank you september 14 three o'clock eastern standard time we have a we now have a website

[00:09:32] [SPEAKER_01]: because this morphs so quickly it's called one word the protocol live so t h e p r o t o c o l

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_01]: l i v e dot com okay on there are four links that will go live on september 14th at three

[00:09:44] [SPEAKER_01]: o'clock those four links will bring you to eventbrite they go live and then you can

[00:09:48] [SPEAKER_01]: register right there there's a limited amount of seats for all four courses and then there'll

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_01]: be a wait list like before i went back i didn't tell you this since we saw each other

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_01]: i went back to take a look and these courses we have 14 people that's that's what we limited

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_01]: to because too big we had 16 to 18 people on each waiting list for each course oh wow so you

[00:10:10] [SPEAKER_03]: literally had course another course worth of people waiting yeah i get it i get right so

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: i'm gonna email those people out that weren't able to register for the next course and say

[00:10:18] [SPEAKER_01]: hey listen you want to make sure that uh yeah you know if you want to get on go september

[00:10:22] [SPEAKER_01]: 14th and then people have been blowing up my dms left and right i'm coming i'm coming i'm coming i

[00:10:30] [SPEAKER_01]: because you know remember the old field of dreams yeah they did it worked it happened

[00:10:36] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah i bet i'm again i'm very much i call myself reality rob i'm a realist i didn't think

[00:10:42] [SPEAKER_03]: this was going to be like this no that's fair that's fair you didn't know but i'm

[00:10:46] [SPEAKER_03]: this website by the way is terrific i'm looking at it right now i know i should be listening

[00:10:49] [SPEAKER_03]: but the website is really well put together we'll put it up in the in the facebook group

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_03]: the very dental facebook group but also on the show notes and honestly timing wise i want to

[00:10:57] [SPEAKER_03]: say this episode is going to drop like a week from today which is the third so literally if

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_03]: you're listening to this put it on your calendar that you said what was the date that that it

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_03]: becomes available the 14th so it'll be the following i think tuesday tuesday okay so you've

[00:11:09] [SPEAKER_03]: got you've got a weekend to think about it they've got four dates four course dates up

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_03]: with buttons you can push so if you're thinking about it get ready on that 14th because it's

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_03]: you're not going to have the window will be small to get in there so that's that's awesome

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_01]: good for you guys man thank you thank you very much thanks for helping out too and helping

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_01]: us get the word out um the last time we again it's a work in progress again everybody i want

[00:11:32] [SPEAKER_01]: this no i wasn't what people understand this is real we put each course date out one at a

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_01]: time this year and when the course date went out it sold out in 24 hours so if i put it out by

[00:11:44] [SPEAKER_01]: eight or nine o'clock that night the next night by eight o'clock it was it was sold out so i

[00:11:49] [SPEAKER_01]: said okay let's try something let's people have different times of the year they want to come

[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah let's put them all out there at one time three of the four times during the year

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_01]: the february may and november are maybe the three best times to come

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_01]: to florida i wasn't even planning on having an august one but it seemed like a good time

[00:12:06] [SPEAKER_01]: before labor day weekend it's after kids start going back to school in florida so i thought okay

[00:12:11] [SPEAKER_01]: let's add the one in august and actually turned out really really well less crowded here in

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_01]: florida but yeah we'll see how this goes um i'd love to be able to provide this for a while

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_03]: yeah well it sounds it sounds like it sounds like you're going to be able to yeah it sounds

[00:12:26] [SPEAKER_03]: like the demand is going to outstrip the supply which is not a bad place for you to be

[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_03]: and people the word is getting out too so that's fantastic thank you so i want to bring i

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_03]: bring it back to something you and i talked about before like i said five years ago we did

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_03]: we did a podcast about uh they're okay so dentists of a certain age let's say you me

[00:12:44] [SPEAKER_03]: or around probably probably gen x dentists in a lot of cases we we were sort of uh sort of

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_03]: came age in a time and i don't know if it was like this before or not but there was there

[00:12:53] [SPEAKER_03]: was definitely a push towards uh the super dentist the decathlon dentist that never let

[00:12:59] [SPEAKER_03]: a procedure go outside your office because that's that's uh patients want to stay in your

[00:13:04] [SPEAKER_03]: office which may or may not be true but you know patients really want to stay in your office

[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_03]: patients want you to be able they trust you they want you to do the procedure and we got i

[00:13:11] [SPEAKER_03]: i mean especially early 2000s i was on dental town there was a lot of that and let's be

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_03]: frank there's still a fair amount of that but a lot of us were so steeped in it that

[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_03]: like it kind of psychologically affected us and i've got some stories about that but but

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_03]: about rob is that it didn't really you you decided well well back there that that was not

[00:13:33] [SPEAKER_03]: necessarily the thing for you you knew what you wanted to do and it didn't necessarily

[00:13:37] [SPEAKER_03]: include a lot of the specialty stuff that that uh is tantalizing for a new dentist to

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_03]: learn and that sort of thing so tell me about that how did you know what you wanted to do

[00:13:49] [SPEAKER_01]: i'll make it brief as much as i can i i came out of school and it was just something in

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_01]: my mind that really started in the mid 90s yeah mid to late 90s it was sort of a school in the

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_01]: early 90s and i could see there seemed to be a transformational thing going on from

[00:14:14] [SPEAKER_01]: needs-based dentistry to wants-based dentistry and because ivacar did such a wonderful job

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_01]: of providing that pathway of doing small designs using pressable ceramics original

[00:14:24] [SPEAKER_01]: material which kind of leveled the playing field i said geez you know i really like this i like

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_01]: where this is going i like some of the possibilities here and i never really had any

[00:14:37] [SPEAKER_01]: drive inclination motivation to take into education after dental school about endo or

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_01]: extractions implants i actually don't i don't even really like blood that much that's another

[00:14:54] [SPEAKER_01]: just had no desire to provide those services and this is pre even in this line i said well

[00:15:01] [SPEAKER_01]: if i don't enjoy those things and i'm seeing that there's this whole transformational thing

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_01]: going on in dentistry to provide prettier teeth more predictably let me focus on that and i

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_01]: put i went all out i mean i took so much ce on smile design porcelain adhesive cements

[00:15:19] [SPEAKER_01]: started teaching at a pack live back in the late 90s and at that same time i had already been

[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_01]: through foundationally taking the dawson academy on occlusion but i clearly remember

[00:15:31] [SPEAKER_01]: that at the time pete dawson who was one of our you know you start naming people by the

[00:15:38] [SPEAKER_01]: giant dentistry right there's john there's frank there's pete there's gordon you know

[00:15:42] [SPEAKER_01]: i remember him clearly staying you can't alter vertical dimension of occlusion and which

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_01]: put my head back because that's kind of what you did with dentures dentures every single day

[00:15:50] [SPEAKER_01]: you're doing dentures yeah exactly you were doing dentures you were opening the vertical

[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_01]: dimension of occlusion so so something doesn't sound right there and then i started doing all

[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_01]: of these rehabilitations where you are actually in a sense opening the vertical dimension

[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_01]: i started taking courses from frank spear who said i don't equilibrate every single patient

[00:16:05] [SPEAKER_01]: that comes in my practice you do a large exhale and all of a sudden i said you know

[00:16:10] [SPEAKER_01]: there's again there's a pathway here of doing the type of dentistry i want to do

[00:16:14] [SPEAKER_01]: without getting involved in the other facets of it and i think for me it was a good decision

[00:16:21] [SPEAKER_01]: because i got to do the things i wanted to do now let's also be realistic and talk about

[00:16:26] [SPEAKER_01]: the downside the downside is i don't have a skill set that some of the younger clinicians

[00:16:30] [SPEAKER_01]: have today sure they're much more adept at learning these techniques and implementing them

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_01]: in their practice also say that they're doing it because of financial constraints

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_01]: i graduated dental school with fifty thousand dollars worth of debt which back then seemed

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_01]: like an overwhelming amount of money yep these young dentists that's not even freshman year

[00:16:51] [SPEAKER_01]: now though let's be perfectly right doesn't even take care of one year now they're

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_01]: graduating with tenfold five thousand dollars dentistry and so to service those notes

[00:16:59] [SPEAKER_01]: you can't send out seven thousand dollars worth of dentistry a day when you can do that

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_01]: in your own practice and you're gonna get that money to help fend off a note i got that all

[00:17:09] [SPEAKER_01]: i was really saying about that was do what you like to do because my the way i really think

[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_01]: about it now is i don't think there's a scarcity i when you get really good at what you do more

[00:17:21] [SPEAKER_01]: of those types of procedures will find their way to you and for those procedures you're

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_01]: doing you become like anything else 10 000 hours right that's the malcolm gladwell thing that's

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah back to the beetles you know playing at the uh the uh the cavern club 10 000 hours

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_01]: you know and you know you you're able to provide a great service and do financially well with those

[00:17:51] [SPEAKER_01]: things i just don't know today if they can focus on one element like i did and it will be

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_01]: productive and profitable at the level that we were doing this 25 years ago what do you think

[00:18:05] we're going to be able to do that because you know we've been doing it for the last

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_03]: well okay so i let me tell my story the reason i was inspired to talk about this literally a week

[00:18:09] [SPEAKER_03]: ago and then today i had a week of two really bad beats one was a bad endo beat and one was

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_03]: a bad surgery beat and so here's the thing i do i i do a fair amount of endo not a lot

[00:18:22] [SPEAKER_03]: i do i do a few cases a week typically maybe maybe a little less a little more some weeks

[00:18:27] [SPEAKER_03]: same thing with surgery and when i say surgery i'm talking like i take a few teeth out

[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_03]: i don't i'm not placing full arch implants i'm not doing big stuff like that but but you know

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_03]: i service what my patients need i have kind of a general family practice sort of thing it's not

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_03]: it's not uh it's not built on rehabs it's pretty pretty pretty bread and butter stuff

[00:18:45] [SPEAKER_03]: and the thing is is that i in looking okay so first was a was a real calcified molar and i

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_03]: just got i just got crushed on it i ended up i ended up perforating it it wasn't wasn't the

[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_03]: worst perforation you've ever seen but it was for someone who should know what they're

[00:19:01] [SPEAKER_03]: doing it was pretty embarrassing and pretty pretty mortifying uh and i i sent it to a specialist

[00:19:05] [SPEAKER_03]: i think i think we're gonna do okay with that i and then with that mindset with that

[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_03]: it was of course it was one of these things where it was the last hour and a half of my day

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_03]: and i'm i'm leaving on a monday like just feeling beaten and then the next men next

[00:19:19] [SPEAKER_03]: wednesday i come in or that you know two days later i come in to a surgery and um and i was

[00:19:26] [SPEAKER_03]: halfway through a surgical extraction and i just said i'm not doing this this is ridiculous i

[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_03]: like this this is this is good this is slow i've already already burned all the time i put aside

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_03]: for i'm not even close to done i i i punted it i was mad the patient felt bad for me because

[00:19:40] [SPEAKER_03]: i was so mad and i said you know what you're the last extraction i've ever i'll ever do and

[00:19:43] [SPEAKER_03]: i didn't finish it it was i did i was so mad and i i was i was kind of beside myself

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_03]: and so that day i said i'm done with this stuff this doesn't bring me any joy at all

[00:19:52] [SPEAKER_03]: this doesn't this doesn't make me happy i hate it i don't have to do this stuff i i do it

[00:19:56] [SPEAKER_03]: but i and i was and that's when you and i talked i'm like i'm done with this this

[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_03]: doesn't bring me any joy at all and your point very well taken was what you need is you need a

[00:20:05] [SPEAKER_03]: referral network that feels like your office in other words it's like they're essentially

[00:20:09] [SPEAKER_03]: picking up where you left off it needs to be you know the same kind of caring the same

[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_03]: attitude towards patient care that sort of thing and and i do think you're right about

[00:20:18] [SPEAKER_03]: that in other words it's there is no shame in referring any procedure you don't want to do

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_03]: and and i think for the people in the back i'm going to say that again there is no shame

[00:20:28] [SPEAKER_03]: referring anything that you don't want to do that's easier to do in some places and harder

[00:20:34] [SPEAKER_03]: to do in some places you know like if i'll bet in jupiter florida it's probably moderately tough

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_03]: in in in saginaw michigan depending on the procedure it's kind of tough not that i can't

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_03]: find anyone to do it but i can't like it would feel better to me referring all these things

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_03]: that i have no interest in doing if i could get the patient in the same day or the next

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_03]: with with little hassle and i i can't do that a lot of times a lot of times a lot of times

[00:21:02] [SPEAKER_03]: there's some weight involved and thus this is why i think i was putting myself in that situation

[00:21:07] [SPEAKER_03]: on some level i in so my problem was not that i'm just horrible at all this stuff i've done

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_03]: enough of this stuff that i'm not too bad at it my problem is i let my guard down

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_03]: with case selection i let my guard down with case selection both of these bad beats that i took

[00:21:26] [SPEAKER_03]: stepping back that muller was way too calcified for me i didn't want it that that's for a

[00:21:31] [SPEAKER_03]: specialist i should have never started it i can see that on the x-ray and then the best thing

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_03]: is is the guy calls back after the surgeon got his tooth out he said surgeon said this is the

[00:21:41] [SPEAKER_03]: toughest tooth he's done all week and me should have never even looked at this thing he

[00:21:45] [SPEAKER_03]: was not wrong to punt it so everyone absolves me of the guilt but let here's the thing

[00:21:50] [SPEAKER_03]: when you're referring stuff like this but you keep some of the stuff in you need to be really

[00:21:55] [SPEAKER_03]: good about understanding case selection i'm convinced of that so when you and i talked

[00:22:00] [SPEAKER_03]: last i'm saying i'm never doing this stuff again which is a perfectly legit place to be

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_03]: in my opinion because if it doesn't bring you joy you shouldn't do it however literally last

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_03]: week i saw i mean the the i think i left i came in on monday and the first two cases i saw

[00:22:17] [SPEAKER_03]: were cases that were going to require some surgery and i'm like there's no way i'm referring

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_03]: those cases out there's zero chance because they're too easy like i'm looking at it going

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_03]: this is not the tooth that beat me last week these are these are if i sent this to

[00:22:30] [SPEAKER_03]: a surgeon everyone's wasting their time because i can get this tooth out i can get this tooth

[00:22:35] [SPEAKER_03]: out in as long a time it takes me to numb them up and i'm like so i'm already saying i'm

[00:22:40] [SPEAKER_03]: going against what i said i said i was never doing this stuff again and lo and behold i'm like

[00:22:43] [SPEAKER_03]: i can't so i know what's legit like honestly i swear it's like it's like the Marie Condon thing

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_03]: it brings me joy to have a case like that a surgical case where i can do do this with no

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_03]: no question that i'm gonna get this thing out and so i took tooth out last week i literally

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_03]: went back on it in less than a week rob i said i was never doing that again i'm like of

[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_03]: that because i can't do that well then get a load of this i got when was the last time you ever heard

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_03]: of three patients in one week needing anterior root canals in my office it freaking never happens

[00:23:16] [SPEAKER_03]: no one needs anterior root canals and i'm like i'm looking at it i got a canal the size but

[00:23:21] [SPEAKER_03]: and there's i'm like i can't send that out the endodontist would laugh at me but more than

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_03]: that the patient doesn't really want to go to someone else and i can do this with my

[00:23:28] [SPEAKER_03]: eyes closed this one's so as much as i was telling you i'll never do this stuff again i'm

[00:23:33] [SPEAKER_03]: lying because but i certainly can say i don't want to do posterior teeth in endo i don't

[00:23:37] [SPEAKER_03]: do it even the easy ones screw it and adonis loved me when i because i send them stuff like

[00:23:42] [SPEAKER_03]: that that they'll do all day every day and i can do this stuff and i mean this is so

[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_03]: this is so routine this is case selection is everything and i'm convinced that if you slip on

[00:23:53] [SPEAKER_03]: that like i did i slipped on it my case selection was bad two times in a row you

[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_03]: got you start feeling and i know that there's been tons of dentists out there that have

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_03]: given up procedures and then come back to them and been doing great and then they give

[00:24:04] [SPEAKER_03]: up again because they hit another one and i'm that guy i've done i've i've given up endo usually

[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_03]: i give up endo after i've bought a very expensive new endo system that's typically

[00:24:12] [SPEAKER_03]: my my move i like to i like to buy a couple you know you know several thousand dollars

[00:24:16] [SPEAKER_03]: worth of equipment and handpieces then decide i'm not doing endo anymore i have

[00:24:19] [SPEAKER_03]: multiple systems sitting there so the story is is that the all restorative if if you can do

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_03]: that if you are in a position like rob is where literally he is now the guy people are

[00:24:30] [SPEAKER_03]: seeking out for that kind of care of course you do that why would you throw endo in what

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_03]: you're doing you wouldn't that's crazy right now your setup is so good for what you're doing

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_03]: you're teaching the course to take on it for crying out loud so why would i i don't see rob

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_03]: deciding at this point to go learn a little bit of rotary endo to throw in on top of just

[00:24:48] [SPEAKER_03]: just for the sheer fun of it am i right rob uh you're correct and that's the one thing

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_01]: i could tell you that you're correct but i'm going to give you an addendum since we saw

[00:24:56] [SPEAKER_01]: other two so we get a call you did some wisdom teeth didn't you rob admit it you did some

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_01]: wisdom teeth very close i get off my father-in-law who lives in our south and my mother-in-law said

[00:25:07] [SPEAKER_01]: oh he's got a swelling she took a picture of his face so in the office i went in on monday

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_01]: and they drove up to see me and he has a bad tooth on the lower right side i think it's

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_01]: number 31 he's got a pretty bad abscess now we've been nursing this thing along for a while

[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_01]: trying to hold on to as long as we can he's 81 years old so i was just trying to hold on

[00:25:25] [SPEAKER_01]: dentition as long as possible and he doesn't need the tooth but i was holding on to it we

[00:25:30] [SPEAKER_01]: were doing scaling root planing we used our laser we put a rest in there anyway it blew up

[00:25:35] [SPEAKER_01]: it blew out bad and so i said oh well he's already here uh let me go ahead and i put him

[00:25:44] [SPEAKER_01]: on antibiotic they called me actually on sunday so i called him some augmentin called him in

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_01]: some flagell and said let me see him on monday well of course the swelling goes down

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_01]: 50 by the time he comes yeah of course it does and it has a class two mobility yeah i said you know

[00:26:00] [SPEAKER_01]: what isabel your dad let me go ahead and numb him up and take it out and at that moment i stopped

[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_01]: for a second i looked at him i looked at isabel my wife who's a dentist as well i go why am

[00:26:12] [SPEAKER_01]: i doing this again why am i doing this i haven't taken a tooth out and i'm not kidding you

[00:26:19] [SPEAKER_01]: i've been doing this since 2004 since a hurricane in 2004 17 years ago okay okay and it was flapping

[00:26:24] [SPEAKER_01]: in the wind like like like the hurricane like the hurricane like the hurricane and i robbed

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_03]: the hurricane ridder that's what we call you that's how that's how extractions are because he

[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_03]: doesn't take him out unless they're flapping like a hurricane i like that i i said you know

[00:26:38] [SPEAKER_01]: what changed my mind i'm not going to take this tooth out let me refer him to my oral surgeon

[00:26:44] [SPEAKER_01]: who's used to doing this so he goes over to see my old surgeon he does the exam looks at the medical

[00:26:49] [SPEAKER_01]: history and says you know i think i want to have him go see his cardiologist first cardiologist

[00:26:59] [SPEAKER_01]: calls back the next day and says that was a good move because he's on plavix and if he would

[00:27:03] [SPEAKER_01]: have removed the tooth you would have had a very difficult time stopping the bleeding so

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_01]: once again if something inside of me at my inner monitor said ridder don't be a hero

[00:27:19] [SPEAKER_01]: don't try to do something that you're not used to doing let the person who does this

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_01]: all the time do it and of course they said you know what wait a week put take him off

[00:27:27] [SPEAKER_01]: of plavix on tuesday so when he goes in next tuesday he'll be off of plavix for a week

[00:27:31] [SPEAKER_01]: he will have had the flash rule and the augmented in his system so he'll heal up quite

[00:27:37] [SPEAKER_01]: here's my thing i'm just not doing things i don't do i'm not doing it and don't call me to add it

[00:27:42] [SPEAKER_01]: now i've got alan i got somewhere between probably five and seven years left to practice right and

[00:27:49] [SPEAKER_01]: why am i going to start i always use the same analogy i saw you know who pat allen is who

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_03]: does the yes oh yeah he's the best yeah guess what guess what i saw pat allen at the vetter

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_03]: society go figure oh there we go which i see yeah because rob was at the vetter society

[00:28:05] [SPEAKER_03]: interestingly i got him there but i didn't get to see him i didn't get to go up to see him but yeah

[00:28:09] [SPEAKER_03]: so every every excellent speaker i've ever seen has been at the vetter society meeting which

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_03]: is coming up this go check out the very evident on facebook group we're having people there

[00:28:17] [SPEAKER_03]: they're having very dental people there and yes rob was there as well but so i pat allen you

[00:28:21] [SPEAKER_01]: were saying pat allen but one more thing about vetter that is the most ridiculously

[00:28:26] [SPEAKER_01]: inexpensive education at a resort in northern michigan that is going to be dangerous it was

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_01]: the most memorable time i've ever gone somewhere to give a lecture the hospitality was first class

[00:28:38] [SPEAKER_03]: the only thing missing was you of course so back yeah well get a load of this it's hornbrook

[00:28:42] [SPEAKER_03]: it's hornbrook for for a weekend and and it's 300 bucks for a guest people are nuts if you

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER_03]: don't come up anyhow go ahead for sure the travel is way more expensive than the course

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_01]: will be it is it's three days too if you're not getting a one-day lecture you're getting

[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_01]: a lecture yes it's not it's insane so pat allen i've not seen somebody able to do what he does

[00:29:04] [SPEAKER_01]: now he's not a young man let's let's hear so i said to myself but he acts and works like

[00:29:10] [SPEAKER_01]: you know he skis better than most everybody i know yeah and he's a phenomenal he's a

[00:29:16] [SPEAKER_01]: gentleman i mean he's just the best in everything great guy but shockingly good

[00:29:19] [SPEAKER_01]: clinician like well he does is just amazing yeah off the charts i said to myself okay what

[00:29:24] [SPEAKER_01]: if i take his even 10 years ago what if i took his course 10 years later i'm still not going to be

[00:29:31] [SPEAKER_01]: half the clinician he is right where's my periodontist who took his course 15 years ago

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_01]: does alloderm grafts i'm not gonna say as good as pat allen damn good why am i gonna do

[00:29:42] [SPEAKER_01]: something i'm never gonna get great at not doing it i'm not gonna do it that's not how i

[00:29:48] [SPEAKER_01]: want to that's not how i want to live i want to live and run with people who are really

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_01]: good at what they do because there's no joy in mediocrity there isn't there's there's just not

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_01]: you get a kick out of it when you do something kick ass right yeah well um that's what i do and

[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_01]: i've been very happy with that selection for many years i can tell you i probably haven't made

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_01]: as much money as if i was doing other things because i think my production numbers would have

[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_01]: in some other times yet i can look back on my cases that are in the mouth 20 plus years that

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_01]: are still in the mouth and i think that's about as good of a testament to my path that that i

[00:30:31] [SPEAKER_03]: could tell you that's i mean it's fantastic now the story is we have a lot of people a

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_03]: lot of listeners that are younger and i i'm curious to know how far along in your career

[00:30:42] [SPEAKER_03]: were you before you kind of knew that in other words like what i guess i i want people to hear

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_03]: what you said is that like you you don't there are people that could commit to become

[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_03]: on the level of pat allen maybe not as good but but literally if that's if that's your

[00:31:01] [SPEAKER_03]: commitment there are you could do that but the reality is i think it is probably near impossible

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_03]: to become as good as pat allen in that kind of thing as well as as good as you know some of

[00:31:12] [SPEAKER_03]: the most amazing invisalign providers as well as you know implant placement you know as well as

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_03]: i think you know like on some level there's only so much there's there's there's only

[00:31:22] [SPEAKER_03]: so much money and time a person can spend in ce and then there's also your course is the

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_03]: ideal way to understand this there's only so much you can implement at one time for crying

[00:31:31] [SPEAKER_03]: like the like i know people the guy that i used to do this podcast with jason was notorious for

[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_03]: this he'd get obsessed and like literally he was obsessed with like four different things at once

[00:31:41] [SPEAKER_03]: that's really hard to implement these things it's i mean even it's hard to implement one of them

[00:31:46] [SPEAKER_03]: much less all four of them and and it's hard for you it's hard for your team all this stuff

[00:31:50] [SPEAKER_03]: so on some level the perfect solution is to literally know exactly how you want to practice

[00:31:57] [SPEAKER_03]: the day you walk out of dental school unfortunately doesn't work that way i'm curious how how long how

[00:32:02] [SPEAKER_03]: many years out of school did it take for you to kind of know that you wanted to practice this

[00:32:07] [SPEAKER_03]: particular way uh two years that's pretty good that's pretty good that's like a residency

[00:32:13] [SPEAKER_03]: that's like that's like not you know like i would have expected i would have expected five

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_03]: or six before so two years that's fantastic that's really good how did you what like what

[00:32:22] [SPEAKER_03]: was practice like for you in the first two years that helped you decide that oh so my

[00:32:26] [SPEAKER_01]: first year practice i did um some i mean as simple extractions as possible and not many of them

[00:32:34] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah they like you alan i tried to take out a wisdom tooth i thought i had i could handle it

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER_01]: had a call the oral surgeon to come over on a day yeah we helped me out i did a set of dentures

[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_01]: and a partial on somebody that went sideways on me i did endo that looked absolutely i'll tell

[00:32:50] [SPEAKER_01]: you the endo story i was at a dental school maybe not even three or four months and i

[00:32:55] [SPEAKER_01]: learned how to do rotary instruments which was back before that's pretty yeah that was those

[00:32:59] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah that was pretty new from john mcspadden i was doing rotary uh nickel titanium files

[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_01]: the pair the endodontists in the town were looking at me like i was an idiot didn't know

[00:33:11] [SPEAKER_01]: anything right um and i did this beautiful first lower first molar endo it i'm telling you to

[00:33:19] [SPEAKER_01]: this day it probably was the well that was the last endo i did yeah yeah the pinnacle of

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_01]: endo career yeah right if you took if i had the picture of it you'd look at and say it looks great

[00:33:28] [SPEAKER_01]: guy comes back two weeks later with an abscess yeah he's dying yeah done done that's it i i can't

[00:33:35] [SPEAKER_01]: do these things i'm not good at them i'm not good i don't enjoy doing them i don't like the

[00:33:39] [SPEAKER_01]: negative sequela that comes from them um it's defeatist to me there are people out there

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_01]: doing it better than me that's not where my that's not where it's going to go and so two

[00:33:47] [SPEAKER_01]: years out of dental school i was taking a lot of ce i took bill strupp's course six months

[00:33:51] [SPEAKER_01]: at a dental school not a pocket piston yeah saw this man prep teeth saw how he was able to do

[00:33:56] [SPEAKER_01]: restorations and i said that's what i want to be that's what i want yeah sure what i want to do

[00:34:01] [SPEAKER_01]: that's what i want to be and then within two years time i had already limited the scope of

[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_01]: my practice already it was already down to referring everything out and listen i'll i there's

[00:34:11] [SPEAKER_01]: so many stories here i could tell i i went into this i went into the practice that i

[00:34:16] [SPEAKER_01]: bought two years out and um you would think that i would be the uh the the number one referral to

[00:34:26] [SPEAKER_01]: all these specialty practices right you would think i would be the most important person

[00:34:29] [SPEAKER_01]: to them i was referring 100 100 of my perio 100 of my ortho 100 of my dentures 100 of my

[00:34:40] [SPEAKER_01]: extractions and the specialist in my area treated me horribly and as a matter of fact

[00:34:46] [SPEAKER_01]: in a given four year period of time they collectively sent me zero patients in return

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_03]: huh that's not what's that all about there's got to be some answer there

[00:34:58] [SPEAKER_01]: don't know they're all retired i don't really care now yeah so i got it well you know it

[00:35:04] [SPEAKER_03]: is interesting so as i mentioned before there is a little pressure on some level when you're in a

[00:35:09] [SPEAKER_03]: smaller area when when when you don't have so many people to refer to that does that that

[00:35:14] [SPEAKER_03]: influences what you know what you're doing like if you're in rural kansas and the closest

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_03]: orthodontist is is you know two hours away you know there's there's an opening there for

[00:35:25] [SPEAKER_01]: something you know i got it and those people when you're living rural towns in the united

[00:35:29] [SPEAKER_01]: states of america those practices actually are terrific practices oh yeah they're killer

[00:35:34] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah oh they kill it okay it's wonderful it's an hour away to the local period honest you know

[00:35:39] [SPEAKER_01]: what i would do i wouldn't do what i do i would take courses from my picos on extraction bone

[00:35:44] [SPEAKER_01]: graft i would do a course from that allen on connective tissue graft i'd take justin moody's

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_01]: implant pathway learn how to extract the tooth and place an implant there's no question

[00:35:54] [SPEAKER_01]: if i lived in a town like that that's exactly what i would do but you also know

[00:35:58] [SPEAKER_01]: that practice you have like like in a town of what 15 000 people there's usually like four dentists

[00:36:04] [SPEAKER_01]: there right so it's not it's not scarcity and so you don't have to be concerned with another 18

[00:36:11] [SPEAKER_01]: dentists that move to town that's not going to happen all you got to be concerned with is

[00:36:14] [SPEAKER_01]: being able to provide a service that probably the other dentists can't provide anyway so

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_01]: totally different mindset and a totally different circumstance than what we're talking about

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_03]: yep it is it is it's it's it's somewhat common in the united states but it's also like you kind

[00:36:32] [SPEAKER_03]: of have to balance all these things like on some level there might not be there might not

[00:36:37] [SPEAKER_03]: be a practice that there there maybe there can't be a ritter and ramsey style practice

[00:36:41] [SPEAKER_03]: in them in in a really really rural area like that on some level that probably could

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_03]: be actually but it really depends on some level it depends on your ability to do other

[00:36:50] [SPEAKER_03]: but the reality is like i love the fact that you decided that this was for you and that's not

[00:36:56] [SPEAKER_03]: for you i literally put out a podcast today about the power of limitations and people always talk

[00:37:02] [SPEAKER_03]: about oh you're always limiting yourself like you know what sometimes limitations that you put

[00:37:06] [SPEAKER_03]: on yourself can be a positive thing and that's what i'm hearing when you talk like on some

[00:37:10] [SPEAKER_03]: level you did not suffer the problems i'm suffering because i'm i still am trying to

[00:37:20] [SPEAKER_03]: don't suffer those things you you decided a long time ago that's not a problem you're going to

[00:37:25] [SPEAKER_03]: have because you're not going to sweat whether or not this is an endo you want to do or this is

[00:37:29] [SPEAKER_03]: a surgery you're going to do you got you got you got a whole bunch of other stuff to be doing

[00:37:33] [SPEAKER_03]: and you weren't going to deal with that so on some level i've sort of loved that i think

[00:37:37] [SPEAKER_01]: that's a really powerful place to be okay so here's the other thing that that's happened

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_01]: through the years that i've there are things i have trouble accepting if my wife was sitting

[00:37:47] [SPEAKER_01]: here she would give you another side of this you know what happens when you limit yourself

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_01]: what we're talking about and you get good at one thing you know what happens your time

[00:37:56] [SPEAKER_01]: what's that your name is gold your attention grows without you even knowing it i call it

[00:38:03] [SPEAKER_01]: getting woke in your wake yeah and what's happened is our name our name recognition

[00:38:09] [SPEAKER_01]: and what happens when people say ritter and ramsey it's a game-changing moment in our

[00:38:14] [SPEAKER_01]: oh you know those guys oh i go there those guys are phenomenal that's the best office

[00:38:18] [SPEAKER_01]: mike out there is excellent i can't tell you great things about them that doesn't happen at

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_01]: every practice in our town it doesn't because those people are either in it for the money

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_01]: right and we're not even talking about the entrepreneurial dentist who doesn't want to

[00:38:34] [SPEAKER_01]: practice they want to own the four to six practices doing three million dollars a piece

[00:38:38] [SPEAKER_01]: roll them up and sell to a venture capitalist group for multiples of evidence i'm not talking

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_01]: about those people talking about people like you and me who are actually doing dentistry

[00:38:46] [SPEAKER_01]: they put profits over people first they put they put profits over their team members and

[00:38:53] [SPEAKER_01]: they put it over the quality of their work and what happens with time is they pick up

[00:38:58] [SPEAKER_01]: negative reviews yeah they pick up a negative connotation when it's mentioned they don't have

[00:39:03] [SPEAKER_01]: a loyalty they don't have a following they don't build a culture and that's not what

[00:39:08] [SPEAKER_01]: would be embarrassed now let me also say though i also believe it or not don't believe in legacy

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_01]: i think we talked about this last time yeah yeah yeah okay we talked about it right patient

[00:39:21] [SPEAKER_01]: calls her right i mean one day i'm going to walk out the back door of that practice and

[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_01]: the next time i walk into me at the front door as a patient to get my teeth cleaned

[00:39:28] [SPEAKER_01]: i already know that i'm okay with that because i'm replaceable just like everybody's

[00:39:32] [SPEAKER_01]: replaceable i got that i'm not the dentist that walks around says oh my gosh what are these patients

[00:39:37] [SPEAKER_01]: going to do without me they're going to do fine because when i sell this to somebody i'm going

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_01]: to train them up share all the institutional memory with them so that they know exactly what

[00:39:45] [SPEAKER_01]: they're doing i got you um patient calls up with a broken tooth they come in oh dr ridder's

[00:39:52] [SPEAKER_01]: not here oh no dr ridder retired two weeks ago is he okay no he's fine it's just that

[00:39:58] [SPEAKER_01]: he's been doing it for 34 years and he wants to enjoy some runway at the end of his life

[00:40:03] [SPEAKER_01]: oh well please tell him i said hello oh we will anyway back to me my tooth is broken can you fix

[00:40:08] [SPEAKER_01]: that right now yep exactly back to me i like that 35 seconds long yeah back yeah so don't kid

[00:40:15] [SPEAKER_01]: yourself these patients they love you these patients oh my gosh i hope he's okay oh i wish

[00:40:20] [SPEAKER_01]: he could see me back to me what can you do for me right now that's legacy that's legacy

[00:40:26] [SPEAKER_02]: that's that's legit that's legit it is amazing how it's amazing how um i think there's probably a

[00:40:31] [SPEAKER_02]: lot of people that suffer with the thought that the legacy was going to be there that wasn't but

[00:40:34] [SPEAKER_01]: that's that's okay too that's all that's all at the end of the day let's talk about the end of

[00:40:38] [SPEAKER_01]: the the end of this path you and me are both going to retire one day i mean that's what's

[00:40:44] [SPEAKER_01]: going to happen i mean there's a big you know tony stark i love marvel movies i used

[00:40:49] [SPEAKER_01]: to collect it's so weird for me now i used to collect comic books when i was very very

[00:40:53] [SPEAKER_01]: so did i so did i seven to twelve or thirteen years old i had massive comic book collections

[00:40:57] [SPEAKER_01]: that i actually wound up selling and i bought my panerai watch from the money i made from

[00:41:01] [SPEAKER_01]: my comic books nice these comics and every one of these comics is coming to life on the

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_01]: screen now right yeah yeah they're doing it so well because people our age are in charge

[00:41:11] [SPEAKER_01]: right so they have been going on and they're able to implement because of technology it's

[00:41:15] [SPEAKER_01]: a perfect confluence right now tony stark said you know part of that the journey is

[00:41:20] [SPEAKER_01]: beginning the middle and the end it's all part of the journey and so recognize where you are

[00:41:25] [SPEAKER_01]: enjoy it you know at the end of it alan we're going to walk out we're done i mean and that's

[00:41:30] [SPEAKER_01]: okay i mean i i don't think i'm going to retire so to speak i think i'll do something

[00:41:38] [SPEAKER_01]: other than chair-side dentistry and that's okay too and then somebody said well what

[00:41:43] [SPEAKER_01]: are you going to do i said i don't know yet i don't have to know i'll figure it out

[00:41:46] [SPEAKER_01]: i'll figure it out when i walk out the door it'll be a new day you know i'll have no constraints on

[00:41:50] [SPEAKER_01]: me i'll have no financial you know obligations to make at that point i'll figure it out i'll find

[00:41:55] [SPEAKER_01]: something that i want to do whether it's within our profession or not at length of how much i

[00:42:01] [SPEAKER_01]: want to put into it i have no idea we'll see i have no idea right now i just know that

[00:42:06] [SPEAKER_01]: there's an inevitability that um you know you snap the infinity gauntlet it comes to an

[00:42:15] [SPEAKER_01]: i don't want it to end right now because i'm enjoying it more than i ever have alan i i can

[00:42:21] [SPEAKER_01]: tell you that because i'm doing the only dentistry that i want to do on the patients who want to be

[00:42:25] [SPEAKER_01]: there who appreciate what i'm doing and want to pay for it and then teaching the kind of course

[00:42:29] [SPEAKER_01]: that here's the other thing i used to get on a plane every thursday and fly all over the

[00:42:35] [SPEAKER_01]: country and spend some time with some wonderful people study clubs societies laboratories it's

[00:42:39] [SPEAKER_01]: great every now and then a manufacturer we can't do things without a manufacturer but every

[00:42:43] [SPEAKER_01]: now and then a manufacturer would want you to talk about something or please don't mention

[00:42:46] [SPEAKER_01]: another product i don't have any of that any of those constraints i teach what i do in my

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_01]: practice when i say i mean chris we show them what we use every single day how to use it

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_01]: properly if there's something i don't like or don't believe and i don't mention it or i'll

[00:43:00] [SPEAKER_01]: tell you the absolute truth because you know i think we both know that there are times people

[00:43:05] [SPEAKER_01]: speak about products because they're getting paid to speak about sure lots lots of that

[00:43:09] [SPEAKER_01]: i just don't want to be part of that that's not what i want to do the one thing i did get out

[00:43:14] [SPEAKER_01]: of course was you know it's called the sway says all of a sudden you're getting paid

[00:43:19] [SPEAKER_01]: hundreds of thousand dollars from a dental manufacturer you're being swayed by that

[00:43:22] [SPEAKER_01]: speaker i don't want to be that guy i want to tell you what really works and even if i'm

[00:43:27] [SPEAKER_01]: using materials that you would consider to be antiquated if they've got 20 plus use 20

[00:43:31] [SPEAKER_01]: plus years of quality use of the mouth then who's to say it's not the right thing to do

[00:43:36] [SPEAKER_01]: so that's kind of what we're at right now and it's really the most enjoyable time

[00:43:40] [SPEAKER_03]: to be able to do these sorts of things that's awesome that's and of course the bringing it

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_03]: back to the to the beginning that one of you know you've literally you may have some legacy

[00:43:51] [SPEAKER_03]: with your teaching more so even than than with your patients which is kind of interesting

[00:43:55] [SPEAKER_01]: that's well that's a different type of legacy though right because but even that

[00:43:59] [SPEAKER_01]: i got another story about that um i know it's starting to run out of time but because it's

[00:44:03] [SPEAKER_01]: unbelievable how quick it goes there's somebody i don't want to mention any name i won't mention

[00:44:07] [SPEAKER_01]: names and i can tell they want to be known for legacy in dentistry like teaching and i said to

[00:44:14] [SPEAKER_01]: this person um i'm going to be honest with you when you're gone not many people are going to

[00:44:19] [SPEAKER_01]: be talking about you other than other than your children and your grandchildren do not substitute

[00:44:26] [SPEAKER_01]: putting time into your family that you will never get back thinking it's an admirable or

[00:44:31] [SPEAKER_01]: the trade-off to spend more time teaching dentists they're going to listen pete dawson an amazing

[00:44:37] [SPEAKER_01]: teacher he did a lot for the profession nobody's talking about pete dawson anymore we just say

[00:44:42] [SPEAKER_01]: oh pete was great do you repeat anything that pete talks about nope nope because guess what

[00:44:48] [SPEAKER_01]: crannum took over crannum retired now hes is in charge and they all do great jobs but you

[00:44:54] [SPEAKER_01]: know i mean the foundation was put there by pete dawson he's not teaching anymore somebody

[00:45:00] [SPEAKER_01]: is going to step up so i really believe that if you want to do something just do it well

[00:45:07] [SPEAKER_01]: you know whatever it is in dentistry i can't speak to any other profession i'm not

[00:45:11] [SPEAKER_01]: i'm not an attorney i'm not a physician i'm a dentist so i just decided a long time ago

[00:45:17] [SPEAKER_01]: whatever i want to do i'm going to become great at that or at least in my own mind i'm going

[00:45:21] [SPEAKER_01]: to become great i'm going to acquire the skill set i'm going to hang out with like-minded

[00:45:25] [SPEAKER_01]: people i saw i don't know if you saw my post today on instagram did you see it let me see

[00:45:31] [SPEAKER_01]: i put a post up alan it was it was a picture of bill gates with warren buffett it says oh i

[00:45:37] [SPEAKER_02]: did see that they're on a plane that's right there on a plane yeah i saw it there are playing

[00:45:41] [SPEAKER_01]: together and it says choose your hang out with winners the conversations are different

[00:45:49] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah right i mean boy yeah i i want to hang out with people who have focus

[00:45:55] [SPEAKER_01]: and commitment and passion and fun and that's what i want in whatever time i have left that's

[00:46:01] [SPEAKER_01]: what i've tried to do for a long time and if they're not bringing something to the table

[00:46:06] [SPEAKER_01]: that i find valuable either personally or professionally i don't have time for it anymore

[00:46:11] [SPEAKER_01]: i'm too busy with both my family uh who my daughter is a senior in high school

[00:46:16] [SPEAKER_01]: and next year at this time she's in college and my wife uh my practice my business partner i just

[00:46:23] [SPEAKER_01]: you have to be very careful with one more thing about warren buffett warren buffett says i'm the

[00:46:29] [SPEAKER_01]: what one of the wealthiest men on the planet he by the way he just turned 91 did you know that

[00:46:33] [SPEAKER_01]: wow yeah it looks pretty good for anyone and yet all the money in the world i would give up

[00:46:38] [SPEAKER_01]: two billion dollars to get 40 years back he says the most valuable thing that you have

[00:46:43] [SPEAKER_03]: that you do not value is time that's awesome that's very good all right friends well you need

[00:46:49] [SPEAKER_03]: to use your time wisely i think is what we're hearing here there's a there was a lot there's

[00:46:53] [SPEAKER_03]: a lot to that in this uh in this episode why don't you give us one more time we're talking

[00:46:58] [SPEAKER_03]: september 14th is when they're releasing or the registration for the 2022 uh course dates

[00:47:05] [SPEAKER_03]: you can sign up for for the protocol with uh ritter and ramsey i'll put those i'll put

[00:47:10] [SPEAKER_01]: up in the show notes and stuff yeah i will remind people on facebook yeah the links to eventbrite

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_01]: from the protocol life it's clearly stated what the course is when you go to it we literally

[00:47:20] [SPEAKER_01]: take you from the moment you show up over a two-day period of how we you ever hear the line

[00:47:27] [SPEAKER_01]: alan um i know you fish right um you show me the bait you use i'll show you the fish that

[00:47:32] [SPEAKER_01]: you catch we talk about how we how we attract patients to do the type of dentistry that we

[00:47:37] [SPEAKER_01]: want to do how we speak to them chris talks about body language we talk about the digital

[00:47:41] [SPEAKER_01]: workflow how we acquire all our records digitally and communicate with our laboratories who are

[00:47:45] [SPEAKER_01]: really locked in dialed in to the digital workflow from the moment that we capture the

[00:47:50] [SPEAKER_01]: information send it to them to preparing teeth properly doing foundational core buildups to

[00:47:55] [SPEAKER_01]: fabricating provisionals not only out of bisquerel the pmma to deciding between

[00:47:59] [SPEAKER_01]: whether you want lithium to silica to zirconia the positives and negatives how you bond those

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_01]: to place photography all of those things are covered in a sequential order the way that you

[00:48:10] [SPEAKER_01]: would actually acquire the patient to saying thank you very much getting a hug a kiss on

[00:48:14] [SPEAKER_01]: the way out the door posting it on social media that's what the course is if that's what

[00:48:18] [SPEAKER_02]: you want to do this course is for you yeah definitely definitely that's awesome that's

[00:48:25] [SPEAKER_01]: fantastic it is so alan so i know we come a week later so you're back doing some of the

[00:48:30] [SPEAKER_01]: you realize now with a little bit of time in between is you're just going to be more careful on

[00:48:36] [SPEAKER_03]: much more much more careful that's the whole story and like i said the take home message is

[00:48:41] [SPEAKER_03]: there's no shame in doing all of it there's no shame in doing very you know very specific

[00:48:46] [SPEAKER_03]: things or anywhere in the middle the know what you want and do that i think that's what i'm

[00:48:51] [SPEAKER_03]: hearing from you mostly know what you want and do that that's what i heard from and from you

[00:48:55] [SPEAKER_01]: the reverse is you know time is one time can be also your greatest it can be a foe

[00:49:00] [SPEAKER_01]: or it can be your friend and in this case a couple of days later you've had a chance to

[00:49:05] [SPEAKER_01]: sort of reflect and say maybe i was a little too harsh at that moment because we're all

[00:49:09] [SPEAKER_01]: emotional where everything short term is emotion everything long term is logic so let's call

[00:49:13] [SPEAKER_01]: that long term you look back and says not that i'm going to give up these cases it's

[00:49:16] [SPEAKER_01]: that the cases i probably shouldn't do i'm not going to do anymore yeah yeah yeah that's

[00:49:22] [SPEAKER_01]: a great place and wisdom is priceless yeah i know it totally is it makes a huge difference too

[00:49:28] [SPEAKER_03]: so if you guys have any questions or comments for rob or the conversation we had here why

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_03]: don't you go to the very dental pod our very dental facebook group if you're not a member

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_03]: find it on facebook very dental facebook group and use the uh code timmerman i don't know if

[00:49:42] [SPEAKER_03]: it's a code the password timmerman last name of the first guest on the very dental podcast

[00:49:47] [SPEAKER_03]: and then tell me a little bit about yourself i'll bring in the group and we get rob in

[00:49:50] [SPEAKER_03]: we can we can have good conversations again look for those dates coming up for uh the protocol

[00:49:55] [SPEAKER_03]: 2022 and rob thank you a ton for being on as always i mean we love having you here and

[00:49:59] [SPEAKER_03]: and uh there's a lot of wisdom there this was fun i think honestly i think we even did better

[00:50:02] [SPEAKER_01]: this time than the than the lost episode yeah it'll be considered the lost episodes like

[00:50:07] [SPEAKER_01]: where did those 53 minutes go but i alan again i love that you have me on i really

[00:50:12] [SPEAKER_01]: appreciate it this hour it flies by so quickly it does it does i i really believe you know we

[00:50:18] [SPEAKER_01]: both love what we do and it's easy to just talk about something that you do it's difficult

[00:50:22] [SPEAKER_01]: to talk about something you don't do so for us i think it's we love it and we're involved in

[00:50:26] [SPEAKER_01]: it on many different levels and i just always appreciate your thoughtfulness and your time

[00:50:30] [SPEAKER_03]: that you give me thank you very much thanks a ton rob we'll talk to you soon