Very Dental: The Evolution of Hands On with Dr. Justin Moody

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[00:01:30] This is a production of the Veridental Podcast Network.

[00:01:34] This is the Veridental Podcast.

[00:01:42] Welcome to the Veridental Podcast where you'll find entertaining and relevant conversations with

[00:01:52] visionaries, clinicians and your friends in the dental space. Now here's your host Dr. Alan Mead.

[00:01:59] Veridental people welcome to another episode of the Veridental Podcast. I'm your host Dr.

[00:02:03] Alan Mead joining me. A triumphant return really because it's been a little while. Dr. Justin Moody

[00:02:10] Oh man, I'm great. How are you? Good to see you. I think the last time I saw you face to face

[00:02:17] was in Scottsdale for voices of dentistry 2023 so that was more than a year ago.

[00:02:21] That is correct. That is freaking wild. I haven't been in a plane for more than a year.

[00:02:26] Like somehow or another, since VOD 2023, I've become a hermit I guess.

[00:02:31] Well, I mean, you got Giro and that. Yeah, I got plenty of stuff to do. Don't be too far.

[00:02:37] Yeah, you got life. You got snow to shovel and like, yeah, I love you.

[00:02:40] You got lots of stuff to do. I don't think I've been on this podcast actually.

[00:02:48] I'm not sure you have either me. Yeah, maybe. I know we do the alien.

[00:02:51] They're literally on this one. But yeah, it's so welcome. Welcome. I mean, Justin is coming to

[00:02:57] me from are you in Scottsdale right now? Well, I am. Okay, so he's in Arizona. I woke up to snow.

[00:03:03] Justin, do you miss that at all? No. When I opened the blinds, there was a pool and a cactus

[00:03:10] and nothing but sunshine. So yeah, I don't miss that. Yeah, you're not feeling horror.

[00:03:15] I mean, you had plenty that. Don't get me wrong. You're from Nebraska. So you know a little bit about

[00:03:18] snow and wind and prairie and all that stuff. If I want to hear about it, I'll call my dad and

[00:03:23] my brother and after how the cattle are doing. So yeah, do you ever just tell them, no,

[00:03:27] I'm not coming home because I don't need any of that or do you go home? I try to go home twice a

[00:03:32] year and I make them come to me more than that. I mean, honestly, it's hard to argue.

[00:03:39] Having friends in Arizona, you don't get a lot of Arizona's going, no, no, really, I want to come

[00:03:43] visit you in Michigan in February. That sounds great. Not February. Not February. I gotta say,

[00:03:48] I went to the mid-winner a couple weeks ago and it was like 68 degrees in Chicago. Mid-winner,

[00:03:53] you know mid-winner mid-winner is a role of the dice. It could be 70 degrees or it could be 20 below.

[00:03:57] It could be anything. Well, the wind howl, I guess. Yeah, exactly. So so moody and I saw

[00:04:05] them at the voices of dentistry in 2023 and then we kind of we've it's been I talk with them

[00:04:10] and I text with them and stuff but I haven't seen them very much and so a lot of stuff has happened

[00:04:15] I think since I saw you last so last time I saw you you were in the implant pathway was in actually

[00:04:22] I thought it was a pretty cool building. It was the one like I said with all the courtyards and you

[00:04:26] sort of if I remember correctly you started there with a couple sweets and then sort of like just

[00:04:32] oozed out and absorbed more of the sweets of this area. So tell me a little bit about that

[00:04:36] building and how it all started and how it grew. Well, it's interesting, you know, actually Howard

[00:04:40] Fran talks about this building. It's called 62, 62 hundred south of a clinic talk and

[00:04:47] it was built in the 70s and it had 12, no it has 10 sweets in it.

[00:04:52] One hundred percent of the sweets were dentistry when they built the building. Interesting.

[00:04:57] Ten dental offices. The building was interesting too because it shared a common vacuum and a

[00:05:03] common air compressor. So one of the ten sweets? Yeah, I just think wouldn't fit in like well this

[00:05:10] my office here at Aldi Aquaman wouldn't fit in it. And one of the things it was was it made the other

[00:05:16] sweets quiet because you didn't have so it was it was much quieter atmosphere because you didn't

[00:05:23] have now without being said when you know just about when we were getting out of there the vacuum

[00:05:32] had this problem of overflowing and like oh disgusto but you know by the time we left there was just

[00:05:41] a general dentist in orthodontist, a periodontist and us so from so from tens from starting at 10

[00:05:49] sweets that were all dentistry it was down to five. Okay but we just got out of route you know we

[00:05:55] started with where we there were when we were looking to start our own you know get our own

[00:06:02] facility yeah yeah I got a realtor looked around and he come back with me and he said hey

[00:06:08] there's this sweet and tempi and it was once we was orthodont sweet one was a nine chair

[00:06:19] delipline it can he goes they left everything but the chairs so to get started all we did was

[00:06:26] you know we bought nine we bought nine chairs computers to run it and we were off like the

[00:06:31] clinic was off on run it and then the ortho sweet we actually it was an open-made concept so we

[00:06:38] didn't have to do much we turned that into the lecture room a couple of offices in the calf

[00:06:45] the kitchen yeah I remember that we opened the podcast to you in the podcast oh yeah that was

[00:06:53] out front yeah yeah that was in you could like look out into the into the courtyard of this

[00:07:00] this is an interesting building actually so then and then so you slowly kind of go into that

[00:07:05] was 20 absorbing some of the sweets as you went yeah that was 28 April 2018 when we went in there

[00:07:11] and then in 2019 the only way we could increase class size was do they go back to a hotel which

[00:07:20] we'll talk about their how miserable that is to do the didactic and then come back to the clinic

[00:07:26] or then another one another sweet opened up and so we kind of got it in turn to the

[00:07:31] little learning center so that we could have tables and chairs and hands-on and stuff and it was

[00:07:37] it would see 24 docs and that was awesome so we went from you know he went from barely being

[00:07:42] able to see 12 almost doubling to to 24 and then in January of 2020 and another sweet came

[00:07:54] open that was a Dalek Clinic and we're like okay well now we need we need more chairs for the

[00:08:00] nonprofit to work in while we actually did the course so we committed to building that in January

[00:08:08] of 2020 and then the Rona showed up and you know we I always you know you know you know me but I

[00:08:17] I always gamble on myself you know I'm always gonna bet on myself and I was like you know what

[00:08:21] this can't last forever so the contractor was like yeah man like we can we can build through this

[00:08:28] thing so they just went at it and then in October of 2020 we opened up another nine sweet and then

[00:08:34] after that we acquired that was a four-sweets and then we needed we needed I acquired other smaller

[00:08:41] unit for myself and four holds and ask for our practices are for our private offices then we

[00:08:48] another one popped up that was really small but just had three offices and we put real estate

[00:08:53] agents around the message is low you're just in Mark man you're just there every they're probably

[00:08:57] threatening the people in these we get out of here we got a sucker on the line we got it this guy

[00:09:01] is gonna buy it for sure yeah and you know what and I'm not sad because of where I'm at today but

[00:09:07] had a chance to buy this thing in 2019 but really wasn't in a spot to be like that's a lot money

[00:09:15] you know yeah you know this and that and then they sold it for well they someone else bought it

[00:09:22] in 2019 and then they resold it in 21 for twice the money you know just like of course

[00:09:27] I don't shoot whatever you know like yeah now I get it we're ready it's much better so yeah

[00:09:33] as in the reality is that like what's what's unspoken here is that implant pathway was it was an idea

[00:09:40] who's time had come clearly because it was growing and you had there was enough demand we're like man

[00:09:44] we got it we got to have a bigger place to do the courses that's what I'm reading into this

[00:09:49] you know you know we were we were really maxed out that that old facility we were maxed out

[00:09:55] in the person that bought it the last time you know they wanted to double yet again I was just like

[00:09:59] let's rebeck you us so I looked at like okay so if I was to buy this because the only way I could

[00:10:06] grow with the old facility was literally to kick everyone else out take over all take over all

[00:10:14] the spaces because it yeah yeah the told the entire building was 22,000 square feet and we had

[00:10:21] six of the 10 sweets already so we were at like 12,000 and someone feet and then just like okay so

[00:10:29] they don't went back to that realtor and I was like hey like you know because this was still at a time

[00:10:33] in 21 when commercial real estate wasn't hot like you know residential you know what you know

[00:10:41] you know you know residential as a cool off at all like it crazy town yeah but he came back to me

[00:10:49] and he says well this is kind of a perfect storm so the the building is this for this almost 50,000

[00:10:58] square foot building was Cox communications call center and so it had 280 cubicles yeah

[00:11:10] with desks and chairs and all the streets and stuff and there's a lot of cubicles wow

[00:11:16] and then there was another financial company that had a 10,000 had at least at one end and

[00:11:24] just like all right and then the the owner of this building you know wasn't Cox communication but

[00:11:30] the owner of the building was actually the owner of carbona okay yeah yeah yeah no well it was about

[00:11:36] that time carbona started hitting the skits mm-hmm and he needed cash to influx back into carbona so

[00:11:46] yeah so we picked up this building for you know what I thought was pretty reasonable rate and

[00:11:51] uh we built it out and now today the new horizons uh deltlant which is the 501c3 nonprofit

[00:12:00] provide patients for implant pathway it has 32 chairs uh uh 32 operators this the lab

[00:12:10] office space for the four residents in the three full-time dentists and uh you know

[00:12:16] and then uh implant pathway which we not kind of call it pathway because we do so much yeah yeah

[00:12:22] it's it's not just implants yeah no I mean yeah yeah one of the things that happens and I still

[00:12:26] know implants but uh sure yeah but you got other you got other people that can help you with that

[00:12:31] yeah I've heard there's other kind of education that goes on there uh it is it is funny because okay so

[00:12:37] part of it you've got like you did mention a perfect storm and this this story is a little bit

[00:12:42] a perfect storm oh so tell me implant pathway did not start in that first building we were talking about

[00:12:48] you were doing implant pathway in hotels is that right oh yeah yeah uh I look back uh did my first

[00:12:54] course in uh uh February 2016 okay in uh orange county california okay and hotel and uh it was

[00:13:04] funny because it's like you know what so I put like you know I talk about money those are like

[00:13:08] so I put like thirty thousand dollars with a marketing into the wasa edulist california and you

[00:13:14] think about 2016 it is 20 even 2016 eight years ago yeah instagram and facebook was not what it is

[00:13:22] today like that's not that's not how people like they were just communicating with friends yep so

[00:13:29] we did direct mailers like all this like you know ask the reps you know all this stuff yeah yeah

[00:13:34] I got eight people to come to the first course wow and not a single one of them lived in california

[00:13:42] oh my gosh yeah they're all over the it's so I asked one day you know the one the shine reps have come

[00:13:48] by and I was just like uh I was like I didn't even draw one person there's like well how heavy did

[00:13:53] you market orange county go specifically he goes he goes you would need that you would not need

[00:13:58] to market more than two miles three miles from the center of where you're doing your mark and I was

[00:14:02] like what he goes there's no chance someone in LA county would drive to anaheim yeah to do a course

[00:14:10] like zero chance and I was like really because it's like 12 miles yeah yeah he's like you

[00:14:16] have no chance you're the least california person the entire world by the way it's just like I

[00:14:22] would never have put that together either by the way I didn't either right yeah well I mean I grew

[00:14:26] up where it's 24 miles to the next town exactly different in Nebraska in Nebraska like just

[00:14:31] just going into the stores you know it's a 50 mile round trip you know it's like I get it I get it

[00:14:36] it's not it's not that different for where I am yeah so you so orange county was not gonna draw

[00:14:42] from LA in the hotel any any potential profitability the hotel probably ate that pretty quick because they

[00:14:48] want to charge you eight dollars for a hard boiled egg and shit like that so and yeah 60 gallons for

[00:14:53] a gallon of coffee 60 bucks for a gallon of coffee yes and it's like so but at this point now and

[00:15:00] like as you know uh you got to go just do the course because it's more you lose even more money

[00:15:05] by canceling it's different yeah oh yeah I was like so I went out to orange county did the course

[00:15:13] and I will tell you that the eight docks are in there I know every every single one of them by name

[00:15:20] I think one will solve them have taken down to every course that we've had so they've stuck

[00:15:25] they stuck with it they start a couple of them are our surgical mentors mentors yeah yeah yeah so

[00:15:31] it was a great start as as you look back on it's it's weird how how sticky those times were

[00:15:39] in the fact that like okay let's just let's just put that into perspective when you and I met

[00:15:43] in person for the first time was it voice identity 2017 okay like that was that was in Nashville

[00:15:50] and that was the first one and what I remember is it was days before or after trump was inaugurated yes just

[00:15:57] just just to give you uh so I mean like we hit it was January of 2017 so he had just been he was

[00:16:03] either going to be or had just been inaugurated that I mean it seems like a really long time ago

[00:16:10] you know like it's it's not that long ago but it seems like it really don't long time ago but even then

[00:16:14] that's around the same time you were starting teaching pathways stuff yeah yeah it was uh uh

[00:16:21] yeah we were in 2017 we were doing um you know from 16 we went from really not having any place for

[00:16:32] the original courses didn't have any live surgical components yeah yeah which is didactic

[00:16:36] out of all can you even imagine someone looking at an implant course now without

[00:16:40] that didn't have some kind of surgical part of it I mean I took I took Garg's course and we got to

[00:16:44] drill on on cadaver heads at one point that was that was that was great yeah you know there are uh

[00:16:50] you know it's funny you know as times or when times are good you know uh yeah the the market floods with

[00:16:56] you know teaching institutes and people the world you know and you know if there's a lot of

[00:17:02] you know we graduated 80-800 days a year we got 150-50 thousand of them out there you know I train

[00:17:09] 500 a year you know what you're big you know which is a big number but sure it's the end of the day

[00:17:14] it there's there's more than enough for the yeah for everyone else so it's not it's a world

[00:17:21] it's a world of abundance not it is it is but but I what what makes me laugh and this is

[00:17:27] this is the second part of the perfect storm when did Arizona's um you know ability for someone

[00:17:33] to get that provisional license to work when did that become a thing well has that been a thing

[00:17:39] or or did it become a thing it's been a thing in the uh the good Samaritan temporary license yeah

[00:17:48] yeah that's what I actually um it was part of a sweeping bill that was actually both in the

[00:17:54] i think 2015 good evening about a little earlier and it in it and it was designed not just for

[00:18:00] dentistry but it it covers all health care licenses so from chiropractice to nurses to docs and

[00:18:07] they designed it for people to be able to come in and uh you know work somewhere again

[00:18:15] and and and give back and then hone their skills and don't think like that and uh it took a

[00:18:22] little bit of time you know in 2017 I just do the differentiator um exciting you know I remember

[00:18:29] when I went to miss twenty plus years ago uh uh you know there was no you could bring you could

[00:18:35] bring a patient to temple university which was cost prohibitive and you know and and everything else

[00:18:41] that was like it wasn't wasn't it didn't he work on the patient and you assisted him or were you

[00:18:46] able to actually work on the patient I think you were able to work on it but there was a lot of

[00:18:49] hoops and it was a lot of travel and I have a I have a buddy who who did it multiple times he jumped

[00:18:54] through the hoops and and it was a matter of they didn't make it easy and it's not that he is not

[00:18:59] that miss it wasn't easy like you it wasn't easy to do something like this right honestly so

[00:19:06] so Arizona wanted to do it to help I don't I mean the law was probably to help people get care more

[00:19:12] than to help dentists get training or doctors trained for dentistry dentistry was just one of the

[00:19:18] faculties you know yeah yeah law did and we had uh so in 2017 um we uh in 2017 I was

[00:19:30] doing all the clinical training for for renters and implants and I just knew like man if we don't

[00:19:37] get if we don't get these docs some hands-on like live patient experience like they're not going

[00:19:41] to be they're not going to implement and that's what it is exactly right dentistry yep so uh uh

[00:19:47] I knew another guy through another guy that uh there is nephew had a uh clinic at Wadala

[00:19:54] Haramethico so yeah yep uh so we took oh I don't know we went to other eight ten times in

[00:20:00] not 17 and then early well late 16 into 17 and then um a buddy my name Jim Smyros uh gave me

[00:20:10] Holland and goes hey man like I think we can I think there's a place in Arizona that is doing

[00:20:15] this and I was like really and uh so it was called the brighter way and then we got the problem

[00:20:21] so we moved our operation to the US uh and there's I'll tell you is there's some good in the

[00:20:26] bad like there's when you go out of out of country to train there are clinics that don't really

[00:20:34] care about the restorative aspect you know you know that you know we've talked about this the

[00:20:39] you know the human type of dog you know um yeah and the place for informed consent informed

[00:20:44] consent on people who are there for quote unquote free dentistry that don't speak the same language

[00:20:49] as the doctor um that's shameful I'll say that that is shameful uh it's not right this all right

[00:20:56] but the place we went to Wadala Haramethico they had an in-house laboratory and you know most I mean

[00:21:01] I would say 99.8 they were getting restored yeah yeah but they would just get it over

[00:21:05] denture you know I mean that's like the implants came for free the patients were coming and

[00:21:10] they'd probably paying something for the denture and they had it and they had a staff of three or

[00:21:13] four uh lab texts that just made stuff so and I enjoy going down there um just you know the ability

[00:21:20] to not have to do that travel was uh you know kind of nice so we went to the brighter way and uh

[00:21:26] the brighter way offered you know had plenty of patients and so forth just the downside to the

[00:21:31] brighter way was uh this is a non this is a 501 CT drawn profit as well but it's just

[00:21:37] free to take care of the homeless of the indigent population that lived out down Phoenix and

[00:21:42] one of the problems with this population is they may or may not speak our language uh uh

[00:21:49] but there's a lot of mental illness yep and then there's there they're completely unhealthy

[00:21:54] and even though they have mental medical pharmacy there like uh like I would bet a fourth to a third

[00:22:00] of the patients we would have selected for the course would end up like one by the time we did it

[00:22:04] like hey their blood pressure is too high like we can't we can't do this and they yeah and you know

[00:22:09] what else they didn't you know that the patients also weren't able to uh they didn't come back in

[00:22:15] for their follow ups like a lot three share air like yeah yeah yeah it saw the aspects the brighter way

[00:22:22] in uh uh Phoenix was worse than Guadalajara I mean it's seeing something in in just

[00:22:28] the follow up on that population was going to be a nightmare medical medical

[00:22:32] medications were everywhere I'm thinking I mean I got patients who come in every six months and

[00:22:38] were the ones who tell them they've got high blood pressure we got I mean we got people who are

[00:22:41] who are healthy with you know with 401k's and families and they still though so the bottom line

[00:22:46] is like I can only imagine what that population was like and everyone smoked too I'm sure that's

[00:22:51] that I mean so like you had a son exactly you had a list of contraindications that made it

[00:22:57] and so those aren't the patients you you know I get it the other thing is is those patients

[00:23:02] would probably less likely to be restored because they just wouldn't come back or they'd be you know

[00:23:05] like that's a tough that's tough that's really tough so early early 2018 might either have been

[00:23:11] like November December of 2019 or 2017 I decided like hey listen uh uh I think we can do this better

[00:23:19] and not that I could do it better but I think you know we as a as a faculty and uh

[00:23:24] they'll do better so we jump to the hoops you know it's not an easy project to become a 501 c3

[00:23:29] and uh we found this plane can we you know literally I uh you know I scraped all you know that

[00:23:35] at that time there were five I was one of the five uh members of the board directors for it and

[00:23:41] we all like we all throw some money in we've got some chairs and computers and we went out at

[00:23:46] and uh you know a little bit as the rest of it is history but in tempi you know man like we

[00:23:52] we saw retirees we saw college kids we saw which not as much for implants but you know we would

[00:23:59] so um but a lot of what I would just call your your blue your blue collar worker uh bus drivers yeah

[00:24:06] there was a she there's a huge UPS uh uh distribution center uh five blocks away

[00:24:14] I think everyone I think everyone that was missing a two that UPS we put uh uh uh you know

[00:24:19] we fixed them up you know and and so and these people you know to your to what you said earlier

[00:24:26] I was like yeah these people have 401ks and some of them you know had a you know had insurance and like

[00:24:31] like they were normal people but you think about like what about is that you had a person in your

[00:24:39] practice that needed an implants you not even grabbed or anything like what would it cost

[00:24:44] them to go have the implant done and have you put a crown on top of it it's going to be

[00:24:51] oh it's me 45 hundred bucks probably at least before before we're done maybe more depending

[00:24:54] on what what do you send them to yeah and what do you think the average uh house you know

[00:25:00] what do you think the average wage is the person that walks in your door um I mean we got some

[00:25:06] entry it's interesting right it is interesting we it could it could there's a range but it's

[00:25:10] probably $70,000 maybe even a little less I think where our clinic is is it's quite a bit less but

[00:25:16] let's just take a school teacher who by the way you know the school teacher is a at a minimum of

[00:25:22] a four year college degree right you know uh and most I would say the uh uh uh uh

[00:25:29] a rookie school teacher a newbie I'm not sure they would make 45,000 yeah that's around

[00:25:35] probably about right you know so even if they made 50 you think about this over 45 hundred dollars

[00:25:41] to replace it too you're asking someone to spend one tenth of their pre-tax dollars yeah fix one

[00:25:48] tooth and the answer is no thanks I can't afford that and so it's those people that we see on a daily

[00:25:55] basis and you know what makes it nice is we now got two now full time hi genus uh yeah

[00:26:01] you know that we see these patients that you know it in re-care these patients come back for their

[00:26:05] follow-up appointments like they're they're they're so much healthier doesn't mean that we don't run

[00:26:10] into blood pressures and things are sure yeah uh you know so the clientele that we're seeing is

[00:26:17] uh and i and it's not because they're more worthy they're it's better for the educational

[00:26:23] environments sure it is sure it is and they're more committed to the they're more committed to the

[00:26:26] process yes like like you're not worried that this person's gonna get lost in the shuffle or

[00:26:31] you know or they're transient or whatever I mean these are people that are committed to the procedure

[00:26:35] and I think if i remember correctly i was talking to borehole about it you guys screened pretty hard

[00:26:39] to make sure that they were there for the long haul too i mean that was part of the deal

[00:26:42] it really we really do like we've uh we spend uh it is kind of interesting there's a few people

[00:26:48] out there that are kind of naysayers you're like oh yeah you're you're making money you know

[00:26:52] i'm buying this nonprofit and i was like well listen like you've got it you 100% have a four

[00:26:56] profit uh educational company which is the pathway which um employs a lot of people and uh uh

[00:27:04] and so forth but the clinic itself you know what most people don't realize is

[00:27:08] a good chunk of the tuition dollars that you pay for the pathway go to the renting the space from

[00:27:18] from the nonprofit and providing money to make sure that the that the lights stay on the doctor's

[00:27:24] stay uh uh you know everybody has a paycheck and it makes sure that these patients gets their

[00:27:29] get their final restorations too so it's uh uh it's it's really a win-win like there's no there's no

[00:27:34] loser in this you know because it is it is and it's the right way to do it the question is

[00:27:40] why how did Arizona come up with this no offense i can't i've we talked about this before

[00:27:45] i get hung up on the fact that why in the world does Arizona have this special uh you know why can

[00:27:50] Michigan do such a thing why it just it's bizarre it's in in a spectacular way but it's part of

[00:27:56] the reason you're an Arizona right now i mean because Arizona makes it probably the the the easiest

[00:28:03] the least amount of hoops to jump through but i'll tell you that um every month you know we have

[00:28:10] this is what sucks too because uh it could be so bogus but if uh in the process of flying for

[00:28:16] this uh temporary license if if you've got an active uh board complaint against you yeah yeah

[00:28:23] the license and you won't get this like temporary license okay so it's yeah and if you've been

[00:28:29] if you've been dinged by the state they'll they they literally review what it was and decide whether

[00:28:36] you uh could come here or not so it's um so and some if you have a if you've got a clean record

[00:28:43] yes it's at least in our loops to jump through uh it's become a little more difficult over the years

[00:28:48] too because those uh those docs that have licenses in more than one state you now you have to get all

[00:28:54] those states as dental uh boards to send the Arizona board of rest says that they have no problems

[00:29:00] and like yeah it it's really um but i don't complain like it you know their duty is to keep the

[00:29:06] publicate safe and yeah so forth so uh but yeah so there are some other states out there that have

[00:29:14] different forms of it they're they're have a little more restrictions a little maybe a little tougher

[00:29:20] uh but you know Alabama allows it uh and uh so does uh your align and then there's got a couple

[00:29:28] of handful of states that have some interesting ways to get around it that uh uh uh

[00:29:34] yeah it's it's funny because i was teasing you before we started recording it essentially

[00:29:38] your new place which you didn't you say something like 40,000 square feet or something like that

[00:29:43] you're essentially like a dental school for dentist over there basically like it's the dental

[00:29:47] school that we all probably needed back in you know back when we were in in dental school well i

[00:29:51] think that i think the answer is i think they're actually probably dental schools that have less

[00:29:56] square footage you know and i think that there's a lot of

[00:30:02] BS that we cut out right you know like uh you know other things as there should be to be honest yeah

[00:30:07] one of the things we've done from the beginning is we're now up to you know i think it's just

[00:30:11] short of uh 41 hour modules that you got to complete before you show up for the dite active

[00:30:17] portion before you show up for the live surgical component and you'll go out of the days of i

[00:30:23] remember when i took Carl missha's course of Detroit you know i could fly there seven times

[00:30:29] yep yeah you know and you know and it was the only way that we could you know even back then

[00:30:35] the internet was really hardly existed so uh i remember when i was uh going out there like i

[00:30:40] i had to call united to get my to make my reservations because it really wasn't like the internet

[00:30:45] really wasn't a thing kind of dating myself now but uh yeah i mean we graduated in the greatest

[00:30:52] delier of all time in nineteen it's true it's true in nineteen ninety seven was pretty much

[00:30:57] it's like a fine wine it ages like a fine wine you know there's the ultimate vintage wine

[00:31:01] it is it's the grand reserve of all i will say it was a good year for podcasters apparently

[00:31:08] that seems to be the thing i don't know i think i will say costus graduated after us i think but

[00:31:13] yeah i'm yeah he's just a punk you know um it wasn't it was a lot and to go and listen to

[00:31:21] three days seven times and yeah you know and learn about pharnecology and physiology like we put all

[00:31:28] that in these modules yeah yeah you can consume on your own you don't need to travel for it and

[00:31:33] that way when you come out the we just in january we launched uh what i call that uh the fast

[00:31:39] track 4.0 and that is okay very like very condensed review of the highlights of the the modules

[00:31:47] we do a ton of hands-on experience so it's funny because in the first three days of the fast

[00:31:53] track which is all didactic by the end they will have placed i think 16 to 20 implants into either

[00:32:01] a model or a big job anyway i'm like that's a lot right and i was like well you know if you need

[00:32:09] that much well it's not just about like the art of drilling a hole on a piece of bone like you

[00:32:13] don't think you need this shit to learn how to drill a hole on a piece of that's true right that's true

[00:32:17] yeah like it's about like having great success by choosing healthy humans you know and a

[00:32:24] bundle bone situations and like understanding it because one of the things that the digest all

[00:32:30] these implants into models and pick jobs do is it gets everyone familiar with the surgical

[00:32:38] kit that we're using because you're familiar with the surgical kit when you get into the clinic on

[00:32:42] Thursday you're not hunting and pecking it over not sway about what yeah you know the tools exactly

[00:32:46] like like like and you can you know how to use the software like like goal is when you get into

[00:32:51] the clinic like okay we're gonna meet the patient we're gonna treat them like a human that would be

[00:32:55] sitting in our old dental chair when we get and we're gonna make the same clinical decisions

[00:33:00] in that clinic that we would back home it if you learn that way you'll go home and you'll operate

[00:33:07] in a safer environment and you'll have a better success because you know I don't know there's no

[00:33:14] real there's no real we don't keep track of the average of the like how many implants our patients

[00:33:22] get and you know I would tell you that you know we've had patients we've had docs of come and they

[00:33:28] they did as little as four or five implants which is like most programmers that's more than they

[00:33:32] would ever get to do sure yeah you know we sometimes in two days two days we're like I wish they

[00:33:38] got more implants but if you look back on it it was because we may have had some implants that

[00:33:45] were treatment planned for like a medias and in the process of it the right clinical judgment was

[00:33:52] to graft them instead of putting the implants in yeah that's what we do on a daily basis is

[00:33:58] you're only gonna do what you would what clinical right clinically right for the patient and what

[00:34:03] you would do with your own private practice and people get caught up on the number sometimes because they

[00:34:08] you know they they hear about forces south of the border or they're just like oh my god I if I don't

[00:34:13] place 15 implants like this force was just that yeah yeah yeah that's not true at all like it has

[00:34:18] nothing to do with the amount of implants it has everything to do with you creating a an opportunity

[00:34:24] to do to to provide your patient with the best clinical judgments and that's what you learn from

[00:34:30] the mentors that come here like yep we have the best we have some of the best implantologists

[00:34:36] in our world that come and and mentor it there may you're creating you're creating an experience that

[00:34:41] will make it feel as comfortable to do it at home as you did there because that's the you know all

[00:34:48] of this is worth nothing if you won't implement it back home that's what it comes down to yeah if

[00:34:53] you don't go launch like you're you know like I tell people like if you don't and I and I reach out

[00:35:00] to them before the course of such like like if you don't have a patient lined up on Monday or Tuesday

[00:35:06] when you get back from your from from pathway like you're doing yourself a disservice because what we

[00:35:12] know is as humans we are just pattern producing machines and doing it the same way that we possibly

[00:35:18] have been from maybe even from dental school and to change direction requires you know some

[00:35:27] in intention like you got it intentionally go in there and change that if you go do one when

[00:35:32] you get back you realize oh shit I can do that and they don't let me just launch if you go once

[00:35:38] I tell them say if you don't go all the do this in the first week or so pathway will become just

[00:35:43] another course that you took yeah and maybe I don't like that's not what I want because I've

[00:35:48] it's 22 you know Alan like people that go go through the the the course and we take 20 docs at a

[00:35:56] time now the new facilities so they there will be some that 20 docs is possible that one doesn't

[00:36:03] launch but it's not you know our launch rates well into the upper 90s but it's it's possible that

[00:36:09] people will many I would say out of 20 seven seven to eight of them will go home and they will

[00:36:18] they will cherry pick the healthy abundant bone humans and they will add that to their practice so

[00:36:25] they'll do you know two maybe four implants a month and they'll and they'll but you know

[00:36:32] you take four a month time still 50 implants a year yeah yeah and like there's 4500 like

[00:36:39] you know like like that's still significant revenue that they get to do I would tell you that the next

[00:36:47] let's just say it was eight let's say the next eight are gonna be what I call kind of an implant

[00:36:54] focused practice and that is they'll do a general dentistry but like they're every potential

[00:36:59] aside on the planet is getting an implant you know and animals getting at that and then and they might

[00:37:05] start the ones that get some experience it might start you know looking at full-art you know

[00:37:10] things like that mm-hmm that last four uh I I'm telling I ruined them and that is they don't want to

[00:37:20] ever see a real tooth again unless it's cold steel and sunshine yeah yeah yeah yeah you know

[00:37:27] and and I always mentioned I always bet to this guy like I ruined one guy harder than like I think

[00:37:32] anyone else on the planet uh atomic graph mm-hmm and he's out of Ohio he said did was he out of your

[00:37:38] practice I don't know I'm not sure I can't remember anyway uh uh Thomas graph uh practices in Ohio

[00:37:45] and uh six months you know I haven't made on time here I've been like six months afterwards he

[00:37:51] like he calls me it's like hey um I think I want to take yeah the full-art course which at the time

[00:37:56] was taught by Chris Barrett and Raj said that mm-hmm and I was like well come back out man so he

[00:38:01] comes out he takes the the the the full-art course at about three months after he takes that course he

[00:38:07] calls me up and he's beginning to say hey I got this crazy idea and I was like I like puts that

[00:38:11] and he goes I think I'm gonna fire my hygienist and turn my office into an implant only office

[00:38:16] and I was like okay well um like I'll do anything they help you along that way and now I think

[00:38:24] he's opening either his second or his third implant center in nice in Ohio and uh just like

[00:38:32] he fell in these younger doc yeah he found something in implant dentist he found something

[00:38:38] in dentistry and it was implants that just makes him want to get up and go to work every day yeah

[00:38:45] and you know that's that means a lot you know some people some people it's uh uh uh uh

[00:38:51] uh you know I call him the Frosting Tooth Guy he's here in town but uh Shiffon House uh this

[00:38:57] biop manic uh yep yep stuff like that stuff makes him get up and go to work every day sure

[00:39:03] and you tell you what like to have a career that's satisfying and it makes you want to get up and

[00:39:07] go work every day like like I don't care what it is in dentistry but if you find that man what a

[00:39:12] what a blessing yeah for sure for sure that's interesting so you're so basically what what

[00:39:18] what I'm hearing though you just said is that most of most of your so there's several levels

[00:39:25] that people get into implants after the pathway some of them are the ones who will who do a few

[00:39:31] every month and to be perfectly honest that's great there's nothing wrong with those people who

[00:39:35] really who really orient more and then there's then there's the ones that you've racked who

[00:39:38] don't even want to work on teeth anymore but that's like so you've got to continue them but that's

[00:39:42] a pretty cool continuum either way I mean like that's it and you know when we first started I taught

[00:39:47] most of the uh advanced courses you know I mean very I taught our first full-large course I've

[00:39:53] always I've always taught our uh sinus course and now we've got you know now we've got Dan

[00:39:59] Holtz-Klaw and the building and he's doing remote anchorage and all these things but I tell you

[00:40:05] what they're really going forward you know the only course that I teach is just yeah you can call it

[00:40:10] 101 but we call it the fast track and you know my you know my desire in my career is I just want to

[00:40:18] cite people into implant density I want to I want them to see what's possible and then if they want

[00:40:25] to go off what they want to go beyond yeah we've got guys that and then and we got guys and women

[00:40:30] that like are masters at this and they and they'll they'll take you to the next level with like

[00:40:36] i job like is to just get people excited it's awesome it's not a bad place to be at all you know

[00:40:42] we we actually in the first of the year we launched uh what we call the the pathway platform

[00:40:48] and it's a it's an odd it's an online home uh it is a subscription base but it's not very much money

[00:40:55] and uh it it's got you know it's run by boar old uh okay you know so there's there's content to

[00:41:01] plenty you know like the guys post and share it every single day i i post every time i'm in that

[00:41:06] i post every time i'm in the actual clinic whether i'm yeah mentoring or whether upcy one of my

[00:41:10] private patients because uh i don't i always want like what's going on in my world to be present

[00:41:17] yeah yeah uh i also you know i also know that like uh you know implant density changes all the time

[00:41:24] specialist technology like it's it's getting to the point uh where i'm struggling to keep up

[00:41:30] myself because old yeah i'm in brother it's funny you say that because but i mean like it's not

[00:41:38] that you but you have to make an effort to be on top of it i get it i totally do you do you got

[00:41:42] make a conscious effort to it it is it's super fun to think where i am like where i am like

[00:41:46] i've been using a scanner for a while and i think that i'm pretty pretty hot stuff i'm using a

[00:41:51] scanner for a while but like just go into the midwinter i'm like oh my god i'm like this is like

[00:41:55] this is like late 90s poly vinyl you know at this point it's just like there's so much more going on

[00:42:00] you're exactly right so that we'll have to what we try to do twice is hard weaker edgeway to

[00:42:05] dental school dipping fill or you know what was fancy was having a film processor yeah yeah you know

[00:42:11] like yeah so and now think about that like uh i do you know of anyone still using film i don't think so

[00:42:20] and we chocked if there's someone out there but for the most part no and and like

[00:42:26] well okay so we got intro oral we got we got digital x-rays in 2008 that was before i was five

[00:42:32] years before i even moved into my new building and i was behind the times to be honest like like we

[00:42:37] had film up to that point so yeah it's like we've seen a lot in our career let's just say that

[00:42:42] we've seen a lot in our career and we're still in it that's the crazy thing you're right what's next my

[00:42:46] game you know i look uh you know i walk by the so we have um we have some residents uh we got a

[00:42:54] chief resident saint Brian Leelandie came from Boston uh i got two docs from uh ls u that had

[00:43:02] a couple years and uh came up then we got one uh uh fresh off the boat of dental school a

[00:43:08] Claudio Merle he graduated from Nova and joined us this year and it's fun to see their learning curve

[00:43:16] because what we've done is we've taken all the bs of dental school out but if you think about it

[00:43:21] it's not all bs because like people they get strained and then you got to clean their period up like

[00:43:27] you know anything else and then you've got to uh do these you know get get through that and

[00:43:34] it's it's fun to watch them but they've got a uh they got to ring down by the tree of blighting

[00:43:41] area and it's got one of these ray faces where you step in front and like it you know a

[00:43:47] photograph of trees the whole face so they could put the team in there and you know i'll be honest like

[00:43:53] i'm not even sure i can start that machine and uh i know i know i know i'm like i'm not sure that

[00:43:58] i actually want to uh i want it's funny that you say that because i feel a fair amount of shame

[00:44:06] no i'm not interested in printing and i'm not interested i'm really not interested in this stuff

[00:44:10] and there's people that are like super into it i'm like i got nothing man i got nothing is

[00:44:15] and and and i think that i could do it i don't think i'm too stupid although sometimes i wonder but

[00:44:20] but like i so what what i see what they're doing is they're i mean photo it's it's amazing

[00:44:25] it's amazing the technology and and they are like fish to water with that stuff so there's just

[00:44:31] remember you'll eventually be old enough where where you'll wonder what your kids are what you know

[00:44:38] the technology that your kids are comfortable with you'll wonder what in the world they're talking

[00:44:41] about it you will eventually get that old if you're a young listener you'll get there don't worry

[00:44:45] yeah i like uh uh you know i just think about um you know a couple of our mentors like weight

[00:44:52] pilling and uh Josh now you know like like totally in the 3d printing they're teach you

[00:44:56] to an fp1 course and like uh another little younger than we are we they're not there you know

[00:45:03] but but i just look at it's like what they're now teaching these docs like in 10 years will be

[00:45:09] the probably the standard even normal thing yeah you know that's just the normal thing and i'm like

[00:45:14] uh you know 10 years from now i'm hoping that uh i'm hoping just to be sitting on the the patio

[00:45:24] looking out over the the the vineyard in napah and uh you know and and hosting you know hosting

[00:45:32] groups like that do a course at the winery like yeah i'm not like my you'll be you'll be the guy

[00:45:36] you'll be the the guy that uncorks the vintage for the for the guests that are taking a course

[00:45:42] you'll be at what do they what do they call it uh professor emeritus that's what you'll be

[00:45:46] that's right that's right that's right you got you got the you got the credibility but they don't

[00:45:50] make you work at that stuff anymore you just uncork the bottles that's that's what i get it

[00:45:54] that's where we go you briefly before we go tell me a little bit about your winery you have a

[00:45:59] you are you are your multi state again tell me about your winery and how the hell did that happen

[00:46:04] you know what um you know i some people don't know this but uh back in uh 1999 a couple years after

[00:46:11] dental school uh i made a trip to napah with one of my best friends quick rising he's a uh

[00:46:17] pharmacist and we stayed up on spring mountain and uh at this bed and breakfast and uh i just fell in

[00:46:25] love with like the yeah it's probably because i grew up on a ranch in farm right like i just love

[00:46:29] like growing the grapes that taking those grapes and like turning it into something that last for years

[00:46:35] and leaves this kind of like legacy so we went back to Nebraska my dad's ranch and

[00:46:40] commandoor five acres of his farm ground when we put uh five acres of wine grapes

[00:46:45] out of that in twenty oh one we uh applied and became the third bonded winery in the state of

[00:46:51] Nebraska now wow okay i got a good idea now there's like 42 wineries in the state of Nebraska okay

[00:46:58] yeah i i i did that long enough i did in oh five they uh of course we were pretty young at the time

[00:47:03] they made me the uh president of Nebraska great for our association and there you are it oh six

[00:47:09] uh it uh are wine or a winemaker wanted to own the is all the place about just like hey

[00:47:15] like it's kind of fun it kind of like was at the same time that like my implant career was like really

[00:47:19] skyrocketing it's like it's i love this winery thing but like you know i also had two young

[00:47:25] you know two young boys and all but like like i really need to plan for their future in mind and

[00:47:29] stuff so i took this direction into implant dentistry now if you've got to remember circle back i sold

[00:47:36] i sold it to m106 uh in 2020 there was uh it was 2017 the 2020 Navavelle had two large fires

[00:47:46] for in 2020 it was called the glass fire it went from Santa Rosa over spring mountain into

[00:47:52] napar valley and i think it burned up 5800 homes wow yeah about 50 wineries okay so

[00:48:02] i'm i'm a you know i i've been going out to napar a couple times a year for probably last 10 years

[00:48:07] and sure uh always you know i i don't know you with you do like wherever i go i usually go on

[00:48:12] zelo and be like what's shit we're always here always exactly always you're like in um so i looked out

[00:48:19] there and there was a number of these distressed or birth properties yeah and i was like you know

[00:48:23] i'm like if anything like that opened up like i get afforded to just buy some birth dirt you know

[00:48:29] like yeah yeah so anyway we were heading out there took Memorial Day of 2022 and uh one of the

[00:48:36] properties i had starred you know popped up and it's at uh uh priced severe price reduction it went

[00:48:42] down like five hundred and fifty thousand dollars on this and it was seventeen acres uh in the

[00:48:47] spring mountain district of napar valley yeah it overlooks the town of St. Helena okay and there were

[00:48:53] seven acres of cabernet grates onsite but the house burnt down the winery burnt down the outbuilder

[00:48:57] makes burnt down there's a little too better cottage to survive and yeah i was like you know what

[00:49:02] um i'm gonna do this so myself and uh Christine oddly we went about the seventeen acres and now

[00:49:13] uh we've got the thing cleaned up we got all the dead trees cut off the angel looking good

[00:49:19] we our goal is to rebuild the winery and uh in a house out there and where sure

[00:49:28] showed the through the permit process of napar county which is crazy yeah i mean yeah well

[00:49:32] in California i'm gonna i'm gonna write and i'm i've started them writing a book on building in

[00:49:37] California you told me about this a year ago i don't still don't still writing because every

[00:49:43] every day seems like another chapter that takes me like ten more pages uh my gosh

[00:49:47] but uh uh so we you know we named it titanium winery um and uh so one of the things was as like

[00:49:56] hey listen like in twenthigen this last fall uh in november of 23 we we our grapes were previously

[00:50:06] contracted to other wineries so um so in 23 the grapes were ours and uh we had fallen in love and

[00:50:15] with uh ghost block vineyards actually had our engagement party down there and they okay uh they

[00:50:20] said that it was capable you know like they're like hey we'll custom make your wine because

[00:50:24] so there's 900 wineries in napar valley but there's not 900 physical wineries yeah there's big wineries

[00:50:31] that make other people's wine and store the barrels and such and then they get them to a bottle

[00:50:37] and then they put them in warehouses and they sell it so they you know not everybody actually has

[00:50:41] a physical place so you can go visit and so we we we took the grapes down there we made we've got 39

[00:50:48] brand new french oak barrels that are cavity is sitting in um and they will be released until uh

[00:50:54] 2026 okay got like it's hard to wait that long because now like four crop is starting to uh uh uh

[00:51:01] leaf out and you're like well god i'm gonna buy more barrels and you know

[00:51:05] yeah this old break like this delay gratification uh in may we will have some uh uh

[00:51:12] white wines that are available the soban yarn block and the sepion but i um

[00:51:16] i told you know christinae we're talking about some like how do we how do we launch this uh

[00:51:22] i hope we got a couple more minutes because i think you'll like this uh

[00:51:27] this part of it um you know everyone should have an idea what they want to do uh

[00:51:32] you know after dentistry you know and my after dentistry is a long ways down the road but

[00:51:38] there is a there is a there'll be a period of it it will become you know combined

[00:51:44] you know teaching dentistry and yeah and make wine when i'm not doing a course and

[00:51:49] uh so we decided like hey you like if we're not gonna have our first like real wine the

[00:51:56] cabernet uh able till 26 how do we get people to know what we're doing and tell our story

[00:52:03] and stuff and uh as we started to go through you know like i it asked another buddy that had

[00:52:08] to take it uh fabletics to market and i'm just like hey you got to know about marketing and shit

[00:52:12] and so he gave me some names some big marketing companies in Chicago that take beverage you know food

[00:52:17] beverage industry yep it it didn't feel right yeah then i remember that uh

[00:52:28] josh over at studio aid nate yeah yeah yeah and um i remember him remember he was

[00:52:35] say they went to vod multiple times yeah they're they're all about storytelling yeah yeah

[00:52:41] you know and i uh i'd always um you know i'd always been following him because uh one of the

[00:52:52] uh things that uh you know one of the things that josh got does yes he's a he's a wine saw

[00:52:59] oh you got you got to studio aid nature i'm wearing this wig they have the best way yeah they

[00:53:04] think right so so i was uh uh i was thinking about this was like listen

[00:53:10] josh is into wine like so much he like so much he took courses and he's become this solemn and i was

[00:53:16] like and i and i really love what he's done in the del space so yeah we throw them one day like hey

[00:53:21] like would you have any interest in like maybe like doing the the the the marketing and the brand creation

[00:53:28] for uh our winery and i think it took him a microsecond to say yes uh oh yeah that's he's born

[00:53:36] for this yeah he was born for it man and like uh i don't know if you've been on uh we he just released a

[00:53:42] video of his experience being out of the vineyard and uh doing some contact creation and it's

[00:53:48] it's just out of this world it's really cool in this world uh we should do a podcast with him that'd

[00:53:53] be really cool oh my god like like i would love to do that with him and one of the things in the design

[00:53:59] of we're gonna we're gonna be able to cave uh in a structure on top because you know i don't need a

[00:54:05] fire burning another thing down right yeah like so you know so the expensive wine and stuff all

[00:54:11] the it will be yeah but yeah we do have a we do have a building outside of the cave that's a

[00:54:17] tasting room and patio and stuff but my goal is like you know i even talked to Costa

[00:54:23] Saturday and i was like hey i was telling you about he's like i'd love to do a mastermind or treat

[00:54:28] there yeah and oh interesting and then these and then these del companies are like hey like we'd

[00:54:34] love to do our like national sales meeting there and things like that i was like you know what

[00:54:38] like like we're gonna create this winery and we're gonna destination we're gonna find it we're

[00:54:44] gonna we're gonna create something that those in the dentistry industry that know well want to come

[00:54:49] out and we'll cater to that yeah unreasonable hospitality and yeah because we know what they're

[00:54:55] going through right like yeah although they charge $5 a gallon for coffee not six right you know

[00:55:00] right oh my gosh so funny that's hilarious anyway if they're out about titanium titanium

[00:55:09] we'll put it in the show notes that's awesome we definitely have to put together a round table where

[00:55:15] we can talk about that that's kind of cool that's an interesting idea but listen honestly it's a whole

[00:55:18] podcast itself on yeah what what i want to do out there yeah yeah that's really cool so that's

[00:55:25] awesome like i love the idea that it's sort of bringing all the world together it's kind of cool

[00:55:30] yeah because this world this world is made of abundance it's not a competition you know and those

[00:55:37] that are those that are out there cutting others down and this to either sell their dentistry or

[00:55:41] sell their courses whatever man like like you should go take all the damn courses you know like

[00:55:47] you just can't take mine like oh take them all but like like you'll you'll feel it all when you

[00:55:52] take ours and then that's when we build the winery like like you'll be part of the family yeah no

[00:55:58] that's awesome that's so good all right Justin we've been going for a while i'm gonna what we'll do

[00:56:04] is we'll put together we'll put together a round table with Josh and maybe some others talking

[00:56:08] about talking about this at some point but this was great it's really nice to catch up with you

[00:56:12] I think it's been too long it's been amazing we should just mention in in passing oh just

[00:56:18] yeah when i'm putting meat on the bone or anything but maybe mention what our thoughts are

[00:56:25] hello what what would you think about

[00:56:29] voices of dentistry 2025 boy i don't know i've been thinking about it

[00:56:34] i think i think not having one in 24 might make 20 25 feel even more important i don't

[00:56:40] just thinking i don't know about you but like the the the core group of of uh uh

[00:56:46] v o d like um their jones and four as a matter of fact they're like they're sad that it

[00:56:51] that i hear i hear that a lot i do too like i do use and i was like you know i got this big building

[00:56:58] and it would be limited seating probably i don't know how many but like they're with

[00:57:01] there it can't grow like it can't be as big as it is it's our biggest winery yeah all

[00:57:07] be as big as our biggest one but what i can tell you is man like you will have access to podcasters

[00:57:14] we're gonna have some account we're gonna have some incredible food and you don't have to deal with

[00:57:18] all the bs that a hotel has to offer it like yeah we don't we don't have to continually raise

[00:57:24] the ticket price every year because the price of coffee goes from 40 dollars to gallon to 60 dollars

[00:57:29] again yeah we'll only charge you like 650 for that hard-boiled egg you will not be seven dollars

[00:57:34] i mean that's like one of it one of the things that made me the most crazy about it was how badly

[00:57:39] they gauged us you remember when the hotel wanted to hold us to uh

[00:57:43] doing voice-to-dance street during 2020 when when uh uh 2021 when no one was allowed to have meetings

[00:57:49] but they were gonna stick it because we'd signed a contract they were gonna stick it to us all

[00:57:52] the stupid stuff it's like the worst part about that meeting was at the actual

[00:57:56] dealing with all the vendors and all the bs with that and that's but basically what moody is saying

[00:58:01] is we can have a meeting where we don't have to do that they have completely different you know what

[00:58:05] Alan you know what else like stay in the hotel that you want like if you've got very

[00:58:09] up points or guilt and points or whatever like stay where stay wherever you want also there's a freaking

[00:58:13] million hotels around there so it's like you know what else is uh there's a lot of around there

[00:58:18] is i guarantee you that the the the voices that are irregulars they're gonna go get some airbnb

[00:58:24] or bio like the parties and my yep yep yep and we will do uh we'll do a great event Friday night

[00:58:31] uh i got my ideas now i'll let that out but uh uh uh and it will truly be for those that want to

[00:58:38] be there yeah and uh well just in case anyone's wondering too uh mark kastis and jason libskim are on

[00:58:44] board with this as well so they sign another dotted line they they they said they'd do it they said

[00:58:49] they'd do it so it's this is this is likely a thing it's pretty exciting well i think it's pretty

[00:58:54] much a done deal uh uh and if they were to keep a weekend open they would just want to keep in

[00:59:00] January 24 25 i mean up to say if that you might want to pencil that in just like we're not

[00:59:06] pencil that and uh keep an ear out for uh the four of us on social medias like uh when

[00:59:15] i will tell you when it's time to register you won't want to wait on it because don't wait we

[00:59:20] cannot create seats years years after years it was always we'd try and get people to sign up early

[00:59:26] and everyone signed up late guess what if you sign up late you won't have a spot you won't have a

[00:59:29] scene guess what you won't be able to come and leach off people who've signed up either because

[00:59:33] there's literally limitedcy literally it's gonna happen so it's it's gonna be when when it happens

[00:59:38] you better sign up quick or you can just hear about it on social media and not be there so yeah

[00:59:43] and have the worst case of phone wall in your life exactly exactly so yeah these are gonna be

[00:59:47] hot ticket coming up next January yes sir yes sir this was awesome i'm glad we did it thank you

[00:59:53] for being on the show i really appreciate it you bet you bet we'll do it again soon

[00:59:56] all right talk to you later bye bye